SO WHAT GIVES, THERE IS THE TALENT,BUT WHAT DO THESE TEAMS LACK COME PLAYOFF TIME?? ANY THOUGHTS

There is not that much talent.

Well in my opinion the problem is that when El Paso Teams make the playoffs their still in El Paso! Coming from South TX, when you make the playoffs even if its the first round you play somebody that you've never played against!

Team speed

Team speed like Sean states and intimidation.

Does not already a topic exist on this called Solution for El Paso to win State.

i believe that el paso has enough talent and i mean alot of talent but i think that the ttalent is wayyyy too spread out....there are too many schools and all the talent is not in one place...i think that one distrcit is over El Paso should create a sorta all star team...coaches pick out certain players from their teams and then have all them try out and then send them out to play other teams....i think that would be the best idea but its jus an opnion

Dallas, Houston, San Antonio all have as many high schools or more than we do. They have found a way to cope, we need to find a way too. Bigger highschools would help a little bit just increasing the talent pool. I dont think intimidation is much of a factor anymore, I dont know anyone on our team that feared any team. Montwood didn't fear permian, the intimidation thing isn't the problem anymore. Secondary play needs to get a lot better in El Paso too, but I beleive that goes back to overall team speed. El Paso teams are lucky if they have 1 or 2 guys that run a 4.5-4.4 forty. I'm willing to bet that 85-90% of 5A teams east of El Paso are wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy faster than any team in el paso.

The teams that win state usually have at least 4 or 5 D 1 players. Here we have maybe 1 or 2 in the whole city.

HEY X-MAN,
NOT ASKING FOR A SOLUTION, JUST ASKING WHY THEY CAN'T MAKE IT TO THE BIG SHOW

no support

no support from who?

beginning with the ad's and the school board members. not enough money is being spent on thier respective athletic departments. they are happy with what they got, and the outcomes of thier school playoffs. if they really want to win state, then they need to do something to improve these programs. nuf said.

Personally i believe that ep schools don't prepare themselfs... what i mean by this is that many schools from our area don't play tough teams out of el paso for preseason games. for instense, montwood played a tough game v. lubock. socorro came short v. shoemaker.. these two schools are from a very high caliber. bel air played some easy team from silver city and americas played v. gadstan well you get the picture... lataz

LAST RESPONSE TO TER JOE WHO I GUESS GOT DELETED??

Yeah, I got deleted Dragon. Not unusual.

Anyway, I talked to a Coach who Coached at Permian named Carter. He coached at Pecos and Sn Eli too and is now at Carlsbad. He told me, The community doesn't let Permian lose. When you have that kind of pressure, people rise to the occasion and do whatever it takes.

We need to raise the expectations of the El Paso athletes and see if they can rise to the occasion. Hold athletes and AD's accountable for faliures.

The standard needs to be State titles and not the current standard of 'playing well in the 2nd or 3rd round.'

When the expectation is a state championship, things will change. Right now, the expectation is a district championship and the playoffs are a reward.

SO I GUESS EL PASO TEAMS ARE JUST SATISFIED WITH WINNING THEIR DISTRICT AND MAKING IT TO THE PLAYOFFS. ANYTHING AFTER THAT IS REWARD AND TEAMS ARE HAPPY TO BE THERE??

it is true and sad.
we have coaches that have been at their jobs for years without playoff wins let alone playoff apperances.
El Paso!!!! get rid of that attitute!!!!!!!!
lets not accept losers.

any other job it is not acceptable so why is it for coaches?

I think that is the case dragon, they are happy and relieved to get to the playoffs, and they say all the right things as to their desire for success, but deep inside, the belief of the coaches is that they will not win and the players can sense that.

Just my opinion.

When my team made the playoffs at Hanks years ago, the coaches told us if we make we don't have to condition anymore. JV gets to move up. It seemed to me as if we had reached our goal. We lost in the bi-district game.

THEN THE ATTITUDE OF THE PLAYERS REFLECTS THEIR LEADERSHIP

You guys hit one of the biggest problems with most El Pasoans mentalities.

They accept losing.

EPTX you are right how can I be a head coach not get to the playoffs in 8 to 10 years and only send 1 or 2 players to college and still have my job. How can I keep getting blasted in the first round and keep my job. El Paso football won't get better until the higher ups make the coaches accountable. The bad is that if people here really watched football not just the cowboys they would understand that. Coaches are fired after winning super bowls and national championships but El Paso coaches have the key to the city for going deep in the playoffs 15 to 20 years ago.

Honestly i think EP teams never make it 2 state because we have 2 much schools...4 instance if we only had 6 to 7 schools we'd be dominating.

Some of us from the people from the community here in Canutillo have talked within ourselfs about the problem not advancing far in the playoffs, A solution we came up is when school board elections comes up to vote for board memebers who make the Eagle football program ONE of there top goals to improve the program. (spending money for the football program), getting top notch assistants for Coach Brooks and providing the top of the line equiptment for the athelets. and hopefully it will attract more families to the Canutillo district. We have come along way since the early 2000! And 2008 and beyond will be good for the Canutillo football program!!!!!

GO Eagles!!!!

hmm, yea db#8, then each school would have over 6,700 students. the size of a small college. if we couldnt win a state championship then, idk how we would ever be able to manage it. I dont think # of schools is the reason why ep teams CANT make it to state. though granted, enormous mega-schools definitely increase our chances at state, it is not the reason why we CANT do it the way our schools are now, if that makes any sense. it's like saying if we combined all the D1 colleges in Texas into one huge college, they could win a nat'l championship. while this is obviously true, it does not mean that is the reason why a school like UT COULDNT win the nc on their own.

LIKE MAUSDE SAID THE NUMBER OF SCHOOLS IS NOT THE PROBLEM??

Unfortunately, Canutillo turned down the rollback election, which means all areas will see budget cuts, including sports. The Eagles will have to do with less money.

Watch this:

I wish I could find the Judson newcomer night briefing that Rackley does for the incoming freshmen. It would light a fire under anybody.

I got to see hime live during the 05 state chamionship. You'd go to war for this dude!

That's Texas Football

From what I have read and seen on highlights, some EP programs are at the level needed to compete for a state title.
I do however find it amusing that many in EP think that combining schools is the answer. Hard work year round from all the players, not just starters, but your 2's and 3's and subvarsity. If you want to reach the promise land, the players have to make sacrifices, meaning during offseason when your buddies are out running around, you should be working out, in the summer when your buddies are at the waterpark with all the gals, you should be working out.
Another excuse is money from the district, well folks maybe your booster clubs need to take a road trip to the big programs around the state and learn from them. The booster clubs job is to raise MONEY, the parents, fans, and communities need to get involved and support the booster clubs.
Katy ISD has 6 high schools within 10 miles of one another and another one on the way. 3 new high schools have been built in the past 10 years in Katy and Katy still has found a way to stay competitive. Its tradition, community involvement, support. The only thing I'll agree with is coaching, you have to have good coaching, but not all coaches are bad. If the players are lazy, not self motivated what is a coach to do?
D1 prospects, until this year, Katy has had 1 or 2 D1 prospects, answer for winning - sweat, blood and tears.
Southlake, Katy, Trinity, Judson, Permians and so on, PLAN on playing into late December, and not at some EP allstar game. Maybe more focus by the players to make it to state versus making it to the EP allstar game should be made.
I would like to see a team from EP play at the annual HEB Kickoff Classic in San Antonio, Ep teams should try and schedule 1 or 2 tough games with teams outside EP and NM for the non-disdrict games

EXELPASOAN nice read and I highly agree.

yes. part of the problem however, is that there is simply not as much money to go around in the el paso area, than there is in other areas. booster clubs in other parts of the state do drastically better partly because there is more interest invested in football in those areas and more willingness to donate, BUT there is oftentimes more money in the community in those areas as well.

I also agree with the need for ep teams to try to schedule tough out-of-town teams (from texas) for pre-district. part of the difficulty though is purely the geographical positioning that puts el paso so far away from the rest of the state. this makes travel arrangements much more difficult to deal with, and makes stronger teams in the rest of texas less likely to want to schedule games with us, when they can get tougher or similar games much closer to where they are.

also something that can possibly make an effect is that some schools in the rest of the state have much smaller districts to deal with (as far as number of schools), so there are alot fewer district games. this allows them to schedule more nondistrict games, where they can pick the toughest team that would be willing or able to play them to fill all those games. meanwhile, schools in bigger districts are stuck playing alot of weaker schools just because they are in the same district and make up the district schedule. thus disctricts like 1-5a, 1-4a, & 2-4a, only have room in their schedule for 2 or three nondistrict games where they get to schedule the toughest opponents that are able or willing.

I think if teams like the franklins, montwoods, coronados, chapins & riversides continue to be successful in the playoffs, things will improve. if out-of-town teams see this success, they will be more likely to want to schedule us, meaning we'll be able to reach scheduling agreements with tougher out-of-town teams. this, in turn will make our teams better, so they will be more and more successful in playoffs, making even tougher out-of-towners even more & more likely to schedule us, making us better still, creating even more playoff success.

success will build off of success if we only continue to improve each year in whatever ways we can, and parlay playoff success into tougher preseason games to get us better. ep coaches should also continue to attend clinics around the state when they are able to so they can see what the better programs around the state are doing

MAUS money is NOT the total issue. Coronado and Franklin could have state of the art facilities if the coaches asked for it. Put a proposal together and I know the parents would come together and those two schools for sure could have facilities rivaling SLC Trinity, Highland Park etc. Money is an excuse. People have have had terrible facilities and still competed it's the coaches that make the program and players have to feed off of them. Someone made a great point that KATY could have cried and complained they lost all their kids and they are still going strong no excuses!

I never said money is the TOTAL issue. you cannot deny that it makes a difference though. & btw I did mention that part of the reason is that there is less invested interest in football here than in other places, as you seem to be saying. forgive me if I have a hard time believing that, rich as they may seem to everybody, the westside areas can compete with teams like SLC & Highland Park (idk much about trinity) but SLC & Highland Park are loaded to the brim w/ money on a whole nother level. of course if you have figures to prove your point I wouldnt object to hearing them. overall, my point has been that there are MANY factors that contribute to ep's lag behind the rest of the state.

another time the coaches were showing us another football video & it mentioned a school to the east (dont remember but it might've been midland lee) who have an annual auction to raise money once a year & it generally makes at least $50,000 each time. that's just 1 fundraiser. I heard of a franklin parent stating that they once made $12,000 raising money in a golf tournament. that was their big fundraiser, but it just doesnt compare to 50 grand. my parents were very involved in the booster club at chapin & while they & the other parents busted their tails working the conscesion stand & carting around the stuff for the 5 "home" games, they only made about $1200 per game (dont remember if this is the net profit or just $ made), & the one big fundraiser (an enchilada dinner) only got like $3000, though it was a ton of work.

Exelpasoan has a good point, we should try and schedule state powerhouse teams like Trinity, Katy, SLC, Judson, Lufkin,Longview, Westlake, all of em. We may get whooped up on the first few years that we play them, we may not, but once you've seen that talent and once you see the level those teams play at, you dont fear it anymore. You realize the level you have to bring your game to, and I think a lot of players would rise to the challenge. All players should work hard during the offseason but how much harder do you think they would work if they knew that SLC or Katy was the first or 2nd team they would be playing against next season. Scheduling state powerhouses would FORCE everyone to raise their level of play and work during the off season.

HEY SEAN,
WHY WOULD A CENTEX TEAM WANT TO PLAY AN EL PASO TEAM?? WHAT WOULD THESE TEAMS HAVE TO GAIN?? ALSO THE FUNDS NEED TO MAKE THAT 8-10 HOUR TRIP COULD BE PRETTY HIGH?? LETS JUST GET EL PASO TEAMS TO START BEATING THE MIDLAND AND ODESSA TEAMS CONSISTENTLY AND THEN KEEP MOVING FARTHER EAST.

El Paso will not make it past the first 2 rounds simply because.....THERE IS NO DEDICATION....WAIT LET ME REPHRASE THAT.....NOT ALL ATHLETES ARE DEDICATED TO THE OFF SEASON TRAINING!!!! SOME REST ON THE LAST SEASON AND THINK TO THEMSELVES THAT "I CAN DO IT AGAIN"! NOT THE CASE AT ALL!!!


YOU ALL MUST PORT FORTH AND INCREDIBLE EFFORT IN THE WEIGHT ROOM AND IN THE CONDITIONING DURING THE OFF SEASON!!!! IF YOU LOOK AT OTHER SCHOOL AND THE WAY THEY TRAIN IT IS IMPRESSIVE IN SOME ASPECT!!!!

FELLAS, YOU MUST TRAIN TO WIN AND YOU MUST COME INTO THE SEASON THINKING PAST A DISTRICT CHAMPIONSHIP AND "SQUEAKING IN" FOR THE LAST SPOT IN PLAYOFFS!!!

I HAVE TO GIVE RESPECT TO THE MONTWOOD RAMS SIMPLY BECAUSE THEY COME INTO EVERY SEASON THINKING "STATE BOUND"!!! THATS WHAT ITS ALL ABOUT!! AIM FOR THE FENCES!!! I HOPE I CAN GET MY FUTURE AUSTIN PANTHERS TO THINK THAT WAY REAL SOON!!!

SEE YOU VERY SOON IN THE WEIGHT ROOM PANTHERS!!!!

FOR ALL SCHOOLS.....FELLAS PLEASE TAKE THE WEIGHT ROOM SERIOUS AND GO THERE FOR ONE THING AND THAT IS TO GET STRONGER AND BETTER....DO NOT SOCIALIZE!!! YOU HAVE THE WHOLE DAY TO DO THAT AND KISS YOUR GIRL, AND ETC ETC. TAKE IT SERIOUSLY!!!!! LETS GO EP!!!

To add on to what Golden Panther said:

Stop with all the moral victories....it only embarreses El Paso more and make the teams look more cupcake

,from the perspective of an outsider...

passerbyer instead of insulting or critizing why don't you just give your solution.

yea no one should take their starting spot for granted. even if you started the year before, the position should be up for grabs every season (& every week of the season)

Jmendoza,

take it as you will, I put in my simple opinion so deal with it, you wont change my mind.

You don't need to play Midland and Odessa 5A teams. There are plenty of 4A and 3A teams in west Texas that would compete and BEAT a lot of the El Paso 5A and 4A schools!! You should look at playing Snyder, Iraan (2A I think!!!), Andrews, or Monahans. You will quickly see that even the smaller schools in West Texas have very competitive teams and would probably beat most El Paso football teams. Their level of commitment and strength of program far exceed what we have here in El Paso!!! For those of you that are questioning me as to how I know this to be true.....I grew up and played in that area!! Try it....see what you get!!!

Most people already know that Black Out. It has been said on other posts.

HEY CHIPS,
SO WHAT IS YOUR RESPONSE??

THEY CAN!

That wasn't me. Someone copied my username.

There are numerous reasons. I don't think we have arrived at that level yet. We are making progress every year though... slowly but surely.

Maybe you guys should read about the little engine that could again, its gonna happen, you just have to be willing to work for it, believe, and play your heart out every down. Yes you have to work for it but once you get past the lifting and intense sessions of ab work (franklin players know what Im talking about) its really just meantal. Dont think aww crap were playing Permian in the first round, just think its another game, lets get it done, maybe we wont win state in our years we have left in high school, but EP teams just gotta keep on keeping on

You have to have a good coach, and a dedicated staff with a bunch of willing kids. El paso has the atheletes to compete. No excuses, the coaches and the whole organizaton should be held accountable. There is no reason why El Paso should be doormat of texas football. The problem is that there is no
accountability. Coaches a players should go the extra mile to succeed. We as spectators and fans should demand success.

SPEED!!!!!!!!!!!

SPEED???? Football is not Track and Field. It's not no race to a finish line.

Strength and Height

Desire and Dedication

Ask any coach, SPEED!!!!!!!

i agree speed is a big factor i mean we have a couple players throughout the city running 4.4s and then out of town teams have a couple on each team that run 4.4s-4.3s...also teams are still stuck in el paso when we leave for playoffs i know we treated it like a vacation last year

our talent is too spread out. too many high schools means too many good players splitting up from middle to high school. el paso is one of the only cities i've seen where you find a high school every ten minutes

It's like someone said some where in this board. It does not matter how many schools exist or how spread out the talent is because back in the 60's, 70's and 80's when there were not too many schools in El Paso, teams could still not get past the 3rd round of the playoffs. So your reasoning that there are too many schools and that talent is too spread out is incorrect. Do you research of how many schools were in El Paso back in the day and still couldn't get the job done.

if you look at the enrollement numbers for each ep school they are just like everyone else's in the state. andress & del valle were the 2nd and 3rd largest schools in their playoff bracket last year. i think it just APPEARS like there are too many schools. not a reality when you look at enrollment #'s

Thing is those other schools have similar enrollments, just with seniors and juniors though. All those Dallas schools have freshmen and sophomore campuses and schools like Plano, Southlake,etc. that have about 3000 students who are seniors and juniors. Thats 2 times the talent selection. Get it?

I was talking about 4a. I know there are some 5a giants. how do you know that it is 3000 seniors & juniors & not 3000 students? franklin's campus is split, but they still add the #'s of both together to get the enrollment.

its not enrollment numbers its just the rest of texas is more dedicated has better and more competitive off-seasons their disticts are willing to spend more money on football than the ones here and the main reason is the coaching .,..,. the coaching is at another level when u get out of el paso

there is no reason that El Paso teams cant make it to state, Franklin and Montwood have proved that, and some El Paso schools are already at the level to compete, just look at some of the recent playoff games, but dont expect that championship to come overnight.I mean the Permian team that Montwood played really didnt outweigh them, or out run them, they just executed better. Thats what we gotta do pull your head out of where the sun dont shine and execute

dude, we have got to stop worrying about stupid district titles, like so and so has got more district titles than this team, **** a district title is no more less than a participation trophy for the actual tournament that is about to take place. athletes in el paso are too arrogant about what they have won or already won in the past such as district titles,so one could say they stop trying as hard cuz they already won something. some kids around here act as if they belong in the NFL, well son if you are so awesome, then why can't you make to the all state team, sck and tired of seeing the best el paso athletes en up in the honorable mention. coaches have got to preach state in the locker room, not district.

Its cause all of or schools are predominantly hispanic. We're just naturally smaller than alot of other ethnic groups. That doesn't mean we have less drive though. But its kinda the same for Mexico's soccer team. Mexico is insane about soccer. They probably have the most pride in the world. But they're 5'8" team just can't compete with teams like 6'5" Germans. Size has alot to do with it. But remember its not everything...

There are so many high schools here in El Paso that El Paso can have it's own State Championship, I mean own City Championship.

What ethnicity? If that was the reason then teams from LA would be top in the nation but they're not, stop looking for a reason, we have no one but ourselves to blame

Exactly!!!!!!!!

I agree with FRKN. No one but ourselves is to blame. Stop with the excuses already. What, a Hispanic can dream about being a Business Owner, a Airline Pilot, Lawyer, Inventor, Doctor, Marine or whatever and make that dream come true, but for some reason cannot dream to win a high school football State Championship and make that dream come true?

Either you believe anything is possible or you don't. You cannot be in the middle, that would make you a hypocrite.

Believe anything is possible despite the naysayers, especially the naysayers of the past that failed at making their dreams come true.

I agree

Ethnicity has nothing to do with it!!! AT ALL!!!! If you are smaller than the guy infront of you (like most EP players against out of town teams), you rely on your speed, quickness, TECHNIQUE, AND LIKE I SAID BEFORE IN OTHER POSTS.......



THIS IS WHERE THE STRENGHT AND CONDITIONING SETTING DURING THOSE 8 TO 9 MONTHS IN THE OFF SEASON COME IN HANDY!!!!!

HELL LET ME GET A HOLD OF THE ATHLETIC DIRECTORS IN EP AND ILL BE THE FIRST STRENGTH AND CONDITIONING COACH FOR ALL OF EP!!!! I GOT MY DEGREES AND CERTIFICATIONS!!!!

Simple question, too many highschools with limited amount of students to work with. Plus those Upper Pan-Handle schools have like one or two schools for a whole city. THey have the luxury to see where they make themeselves successful come Playoff time.

EP doesn't make it past EP because of somethings that are pure and simple. Belief that they can, content in being mediocre, fundamentals and excuse after excuse after excuse. Most teams outside of the EP area see EP football as a cakewalk game. A driven team from EP might every so often sneak up on the boys from Midland/Odessa case in point OP last year. They saw the game as a cakewalk, hell most of their fans were posting here how it would be a blowout. Montwood smacked them in the mouth on the get go but eventually op smacked them back and the allure of just being able to hang around with them for three quarters came to an end because they kept hitting Montwood in the mouth and being able to hang around was good enough for the fans of EP as I am sure the playersn as well. "At least they didn't get blown out" They played with the number 3 team in the state" Do you see the mentality difference? As adults some of you posted it. that kind of mentality trickles down. The Slcs Katy Trinitys Permians of the world do not think that way. It's not about stepping out there and saying hey we played with them. Its about going out there and knowing you belong on the field with those same teams and playing lights out with the belief you are going to win and anything else is unacceptable. Not to kiss butt but boards like these will open up the kids eyes and see that they are getting the support which will instill a drive in em to make everyone proud. get out as boosters and show these guys you believe in them. EP football is getting better but everyone needs to chip in to take the next step. It's getting there guys trust me its alot closer than most of youn think!

Upper Panhandle cities are just a fraction of the size of El Paso that is why they don't have so many high schools. There is no reason for them to have more high schools.

Size

Size is not a major factor, A lot of those state caliber teams do have a few big guys, but overall they are not as big as you would think. A lot of the dl and ol have guys in the 205-240 range. They can run and are very strong. It is very possible for an El Paso team to win state, the chances of it aren't on the probable side. El Paso is catching up to the rest of the state, but facilities, more coaches and better middle school supervision need to get better on a yearly basis

I have a question. How old are these schools? It can be a rough estimation, it doesnt have to be exact?

southlake carroll
Odessa permian
Euless Trinity
Katy

I was looking into some of the things that Southlake Carroll does in the Summer. Did you guys know they hold two summer camps?

Dragon Summer Skills Camp -
This camp is for young players who are entering the 1st through the 6th grades. The camp is designed specifically for younger kids and will help develop both offensive and defensive skills.

Dragon Football Summer Camp -
This camp is young players who are entering the 1st through 9th grades. Dragon Football Camp is four days of quality instruction with the opportunity to learn the Dragon Football System at an early age.


Now do any of EP Schools hold camps that teach a system for a specific school starting from the 1st grade? I don't think so...

Increase the pay of El Paso high school football coaches and I'm sure systems will be put in place by the those well paid coaches.

Cause and Effect

It will meet the coaches Cause, then Effects the players and will eventually improve the programs dramatically.

True, what do you think about what SLC is doing though? That is pretty awesome if you ask me.

Chips my friend there are many programs across this beautiful State of ours as well as across the nation that have programs such as Carroll's, though many have not experienced success such as Carroll has.

You can have the best camps but it all boils down to well paid coaches. Pay a coach what he believes he deserves or atleast on par with the rest of the coaches from across the State and the coaches will sacrifice a lot more of their time to the developing of the younger kids of this city.

My friends increase their pay and the coaches will get more involved with the younger kids, whether it be in skill camps or any type of Summer Camp.

Cause and effect

The coaches love their careers, and if they get paid accordindly which satisfies their needs and wants, it will make them happy campers. In return the coaches will turn around and spread some of that happiness throughout the community.

Nothing complicated about it. It's not rocket science.

Simple Cause and effect my friends

cause el paso has to many schools

Yup that is so true. After I leave a game on friday night and head for home I end up passing another 2 stadiums by the time I make it home.

El Paso doesn't lack much when it comes to size, the top 3 teams in 1-5A are usually pretty big and strong up front. Where El Paso seriously lacks is team speed. El Paso needs to develop better speed in their athletes. When it comes to teams like katy, trinity, SLC we are ok up front, but their backs and wide receivers are too fast and run by us. 4.7 is considered fast in el paso, teams east of us have more kids running 4.4s on their TEAM then El Paso does as a WHOLE

Carlos & solo bea, it is the same in every other city. el paso enrollment #'s aren't any different from the rest of the state's. those are the numbers you should be looking at.

el paso has way to many schools, the talent that is around is spread out throughout the city if people were smart and really would like to have a chance with east texas football all the talented players should gather up and stay in one school. teams in el paso always set their goal on winning district championships. the further east you go the more serious the minds of other players and coaches get. i understand some coaches in el paso have been around to witness players that have shined throughout sun city, but district should be a goal that is already in the bag. state should be the main concern. the further east the more serious, more dicsipline, more team unity, put those three attributes together at once you have a much more competitive program. once again break down some schools in el paso get all that competition and put it together, then we can talk about real talent and a chance at state. obviously the experience and talent of coaches in el paso now all the ends of the ropes yet none have been able to tie the not. get a few great coaches together as well with the best talent around. the more talent there is one team the harder the player next to him will play. imagine having all them players and coaches at once, yes of course all el paso can do is imagine. sun city is growing and rapidly everyday. all it takes is one school to do the job. the rest will come. just like how champions whether its district,state,national championship,even a super bowl all that really matters is WHO WANTS IT MORE!?!?!?! the day we see an el pasoan running for the hiesman canidate all you reading this will remeber me saying this. til that day comes all you sun city teams will only have disrict championship teams REALITY CHECK. til then thats where the road ends.

any thoughts or questions??

well, I'll state again, el paso doesn't have too many schools. that is a myth. enrollment #'s are pretty much the same here as the rest of the state. of course we'd have a good team if every good player in our city of 600,000 went to 1 school. that doesn't mean we have too many schools. schools like aledo, frenship, & wf rider arent any bigger than ep's 4a's, (aledo & frenship are actually smaller than alot of ep 4a's). difference is coaching, funding, community support, tradition, & strength of schedule. el paso is not a football city.

el paso is not a football city
el paso is not a basketball city
el paso is not a baseball city

el paso is a drink, party and waste your time city. lol

Montwood basketball is big

It's big for Montwood high school but not for the city of El Paso. When high school football, baseball and basketball teams beginning getting to State then those main sports will be big in the entire city of El Paso.

True, but I noticed that in all sports more teams make it past 2nd or 3rd round more often than football. Why?
Also, Montwood plays preseason number 1 team in the nation Duncanville on Saturday for Basketball. SUPPORT THEM AT EASTWOOD AT 12:50

Craven Moorehead who else do you support besides Montwood??

Socorro baseball, Del Valle soccer, Franklin volleyball and any team that represents El Paso

by the way, thats a dumb question. Its like asking Chips who does he support besides Franklin.

#1 reason line play,east texas football stress strenght and athleticism up front.

#2 commitment from the athletes,they believe and distractions are few...not much to do in small towns

well the way i see it, is it goes back to the little league and feeder programs. Our kids loose a year of football at the age of 12 if they are in the 6th grade. we need to get more envolved as a city in the youth leagues. We do it for soccer. I think the city should look into bringing pop warner football to the area. It will improve the talent here in el paso. For example, the way it is now you can have a 8 yr old kid that weighs 90lbs play against 8 yr old kids that weigh 60 lbs and of course he's going to be a beast. When he plays kids his size, its tougher so they quit. Pop warner will make him start out playing kids his size so when he gets older he won't quit.

Lack of discipline, lack of good coaching, and the spread of talent.

oh and we're a FUTBOL city not a FOOTBALL city

Actually,El Paso is a Baseball City.

It's neither a neither of the above.

It's not like every kid is dieing to only play soccer.

It's not like every kid is dieing to play basketball.


It's not like every kid is dieing to play football.


In El Paso kids think they are talented from head to toe so they join many sports. There is not 1 sport in El Paso that majority of the kids devote their attention to.

Only because Del Valle won State or only because Socorro compete in baseball and Montwood in basketball it does not mean crap.

There is NOT 1 sport that captures the FULL ATTENTION and ONLY ATTENTION of the general populus of El Paso folks.

One minute El Paso people love football then the next minute they love baseball, then the next minute they love basketball and when they reach the age over 18 they fall in love with softball for some weird mysterious reason. I guess the drinking after the games.

The talent pool is too diluted with so many high school so close together...

Disipline and heart. I've been on the losing end of some pretty bad games, and to see guys joking around at halftime when you're down 34-6 disgusts me. I feel embarrased sometimes. To see people laughing in the moment of twilight, while you see everything you worked fro, everything sacirficed fro, everything you bled, sweet, and cried for going down the drain. The problem is that so few players care about the game, if they lose so what? They'll just go the big party that night and forget about it.I know there are other players who feel the same way. Every team has them, those kind of players are the reason why El Paso teams can't do nothing out of El Paso. And until that changes no team will ever win state out of El Paso. Its the sad truth.

Money is probably the biggest factor. Not enough money to poor into football. A lot of these schools that are great have a lot of money going into the football program while El Paso barely does.

there are way to manny high schools here with so few good players if we had less schools and much larger inrollment we might get a school with a few big and talented player on one team then we could go to state.
the dist, have money but no one has ever gone that far for the dist to give up that money...

You are so wrong about there being FEW talent in El Paso. 2006 Chapin Huskies alone had 3 players go Division I.

Dominique Hamilton Missouri Univeristy
Cliff Tucket Maryland University
David Moore Fordham University

It's all about speed and size. I've lived in two different states and my boys have played football in California and Texas.

When we lived in California, the teams had speed. Now that I live in Dallas, and my son plays football here, I see the size and the speed.

These Dallas kids are big, specially, in their offensive and defensive lines. Their running backs and wide recievers are tall and fast.

I'm a proud El Pasoan and UTEP grad but have to say, that from my experience, El Paso schools will have a hard time beating some of the teams from Dallas unless they get bigger and faster. We'll continue to see schools like South Lake and Trinity not only going to state but winning it all.

Regardless, I'm proud of my Ysleta Indians and UTEP Miners and love my hometown!!

El Paso Teams have made it to the playoffs and done well in the past. The difference is the lack of experience if these high school coaches could produce more playoff teams with experience than I believe El Paso can be a top contendor in the state of texas

El Paso teams are finally beginning to pass the ball more. I give lots of props to Hanks for the system they are running. Montwood, Chapin and Franklin are doing it as well. El Paso teams have to be well balanced so when they get to the playoffs they will have a better chance of scoring a Td or two. Teams like Austin, Riverside, Coronado and others are too one dimensional. The run works well in El Paso but in the playoffs it will be stopped cold in the 2nd half.

well i say all football teams are good in el paso but the reason they cant go is because they lack disipline and determination. i play for odessa permian panthers but i used to play for burges mustangs and over here they have a different way of football i hope some team goes to state just to show that permian aint the only good team out there.

Can you tell us whats diffrent?

some things occurred to me while watching some of tonight's highlights on tv. this might just be a case of perception, since I don't follow out-of-town hs football that much, but it seems like whenever I see ep football game highlights & ones from out of town, schools in ep have way more turnovers, especially fumbles. havent got any numbers to back it up, but that's the way it seems to be. watch highlights from ep teams, it seems like something as simple as a pitch-play rb sweep is as risky as throwing into triple coverage. very often I see runners not holding the ball correctly or insecurely, or bobbling handoffs, or the qb making a bad pitch. more fumbles resulting from mishandled exchanges than defenders knocking the ball loose. the level of execution isnt the same here as it is in the rest of the state. things aren't as crisp.

I think alot of the coaches here need to spend more time on improving things like that. maybe have your rb's carry a football everywhere with them during school on their way to class. have more ball security drills, practice the simple motion of pitching until it becomes automatic. I think it's things like this & the discipline that keeps ep far behind the rest of the state.

I think that we are avoiding the elephant in the room guys. And dont get me wrong when I say this but I do believe tat it is tru. Race is a tremendous issue around the el paso area and it also helps explain that el paso is good at soccer as well as baseball. Hanks, Bel Air, Del Valle, and canutillo all have great soccer teams. This is because of the hispanic influence in the area. While I was growing up all I heard was that there was soccer leagues for kids. I didnt hear of football untill i hit middle school. Another thing is that it is scientifically proven that people from hispanic heritage tend to be shorter and not as fast. Think about it. How many teams in el paso have about a 90% hispanic team. And the people who actually make it out of here are from other races. Well for football anyway because I know a ton of people that made it out of here for baseball and soccer. I am not putting down hispanics. I am hispanic my parents are from chihuahua and juarez but open your eyes people. We cant put 11 kickers out on the field and expect to win state. We need a lot more diversity or for steroids to be put in our drinking water. Once again i dnt say tis t offend anyone. I love my race, we are good on other sports but football just wasnt made for hispanics. Wit all due respect, Canut Ex Eagle

Steroids won't make your grow taller dufus. There are tall mexicans, hispanics and latinos the problem is that coaches don't persuade them to play or coaches don't put them in the right positions.

I know that there are tall hispanic I mean I'm 6 2 250 and i know that there are a lot of tall hispanics but i mean genetically it has ben proven that hispanics arent tall or made to be tall. I just wanted to point it out. And I know steroids dnt make you tall, it was sarcasm lke in the way to make up for size to get super mega buff.

El Paso has too many schools. The talent in the city is spread out and each school has some. Some cities in Texas have one or two schools, so all the talent goes there. When a team with one or two great players goes up against a team full of great players there is no contest. Consolidate some schools or recruit. Get more talent at one school and that one will rule.

Doesn't Chuck Veliz do recruting for Montwood?

Who is this Chuck Veliz character people talk about on here???? lol

The drive, motivation, support, and knowledge is not present. No one in El Paso comes in thinking were gonna win State. There focus is on winning District and hopefully wiining a play-off game. The mind-set is not present. El Paso sets such low goals. and are satisfied when they are met. The overall organization of programs in El Paso compared to those in East Texas for example is dissapointing to say the least. There is not enough know-how in El Paso. We think we know how to get it done, but we really don't. There have been some average teams in El Paso compared to the rest of the state. Teams here make it one or two games into the playoffs and every one says what a great team or program they have. But if you stop and see the cold hard facts, there are teams that make it to the Championship game year in and year out. See how different our views are on greatness. El Paso you need to stop aiming so low and most of all you need to stop being satisfied with District titles and a game or two in the play-offs.

serious oscar? its montwood's head coach. and i wonder if the all star teams we have after the season is over, go to playoffs and play i wonder if they would get far. i know its impossible but still wonder.

El Paso teams need to get involve in football summer camps. Coaches and players, we know what to expect in playoffs, so why we're not ready? What makes great teams? Self dicipline, physical and mentally preparation. How bad do we want state championship is how well we are prepare. Let's not justify ourselves, let's not blame anybody or point at anybody. Before you point let's not forget three others are pointing at you. Players, the ball is in you court.

Honestly, this is my first time on this website and when i saw this I started to laugh. I moved to el paso from dallas in 8th grade and played football and thought it was a joke because the coaching wasn't as dedicated to improve the youth as it was at Allen where we ran the spread offense since 6th grade and honestly I think no team here even seems competitive to any DFW elite team. And I saw the best el paso team which was franklin in 06' I believe that thought it was like winning a superbowl against mansfield summit who was not good and lucky to go to the third round but then when you match them up with trinity, you get a 63 to 14 whooping. So I guess I'm here to say that there is no solution. There is not going to be randomly addition to team speed, they are not going to change enrollments just for football, there is going to be no state of the art facilites and weight room like the best in dallas,and honestly alot of you homers say there is talent here but where does it go when it plays a DFW, Houston, Austin/San Antonio team/ Nothing is going to happen here unless there is some manchild to carry a team on there back.. Sorry but its true.

Im gonna tell you right now it is very POSSIBLE for an El Paso Team to win State!!! Definitely not IMPOSSIBLE as many on here think. Now here comes the biased side of me but hopefully people can understand where I am coming at with this and am not trying to put Chapin in the spot light with this information. I played on that Chapin team in 2005 where we made a run. We won a close one against Parland 34-31, my hats off to them. Then come in the following week beat Big Springs 62-43. The following week in The Area Championship we lose to Aledo 41-35 In a heart breaker in Over Time. My Pops sitting in the stands had the Friendship scouting coaches right behind him making reports over the phone describing our speed, our recievers, Cliff Tucker, Aaron Crichlow, David Moore, ect. our quarterback, Marco Chavez, City CO-MVP and how if they played us we were going to be tough to match up with, and they were really hoping they got to play Aledo. Unfortunately we did not get that opportunity to play them and they got their wish As I previously Stated We lost in Overtime. Where I am getting at with this is Freindship went on to beat Aledo 21-7 in the rain, where Aledo had 2 costly turnovers right as they are about to score. Very close game, No blowout, could have been us. The Next round Friendship losses to Lewisville Hebron 28-21. Another very close game. Then Lewisville Hebron goes on to win State that year beating Calallen 28-0. My point being in those rounds that followed there were no Euless trinity teams that blasted their way through the playoffs scorching every team they played. Every game was close, Every game could have been us if we had executed against Aledo. Call it a weak bracket, call it what you want but Hey an El Paso Team did have a chance to win state. And I really hate to bring up the woulda coulda and shoulda theory but it was that close and till this day it eats away at me. An El Paso team does have the opportunity to win state. I know it will eventually Happen. That graduating class of 06 Fb year of 05 had a pretty good squad, a squad "WE" feel could have taken it. Im sure there are many other teams that have come close as well. At least in my opinion and in the opinion of that group I played with we feel we were "That Close".Granted I know "That Close" didnt do nothing but put us in the category of another El Paso Team falling in the Third round. I dont know what others will think but dont doubt, its "almost" happened before. "Almost" in El Paso football can be a good thing. It means we have taken a leap and A Championship is in sight. Lets make it past the 3rd round, take small steps from there if we have to. "IF YOU HAVE A HEARTBEAT YOU HAVE A CHANCE" Best of luck to all the teams in the playoffs this year. Bring one home Boys!!!

My friend I have said many times that once an El Paso team gets passed that gosh forsaken 3rd round which is the Regional round El Paso has a great shot at making a State Championship appearance.

Get passed that 3rd round which is the Regional round. Forget about the 4th round which is the Quarterfinal round and 5th round which is the Semifinal round. Once the 4th and 5th rounds come along it's a no brainer that the teams in those rounds have great talent and coaching but the question is do they still have the heart, motivation and stamina to keep it going all banged up from the previous rounds? Fatigue sets in those 4th and 5th rounds. It is anyone's State Championship for the taking. Records go out the window after the 3rd round.

It's the 3rd round that is the toughest of them all.

I know what you mean andrew, that aledo game still bothers me to this day.

I saw that Aledo game, and I totally agree. That cornerback kept jumping that rout in front of the Chapin receiver which I think was Cliff. You all had run that play several times, and that corner kept getting closer and closer to jumping that route!! The last time before the interception in overtime, you all ran that same play and that corner came cloe to intercepting the ball!!! I noticed it and hoped that you all would not run that play again. You all did and that cost you all the game. Aledo played a good game, but Chapin truly had the game if not for the play selection. That is how close you all came to advancing to the next round!! I believe that Chapin would have won the next round as well that year, but I am not sure if they could have moved on past that. It would have opened up the flood gates for El Paso football, and we would not still be sitting here talking about getting past the 3rd round!! Good luck to ALL El Paso football teams this year!! Believe in who you are, and hope that your coaches see the obvious and they make the right adjustments!!

WELL I PERSONALLY THINK THAT YOU REALLY DONT NEED THE BEST EQUIPMENT OR MONEY TO MAKE IT TO STATE BUT WHAT WOULD HELP IS PLAYING PRE-SEASON GAMES OUT OF EL PASO

WHEN AN EL PASO TEAM MAKES IT TO THE PLAYOFFS THEY SHOULD GO IN WITH A MENTALITY OF PLAYING THE GAME LIKE IF ITS ANY REGULAR GAME

WHEN YOUR IN THE PLAYOFFS THE STATS SHOULDNT MATTER OR WHAT THE OTHER TEAMS RECORD WAS OR WHAT THEIR RANKING IS

IT ALL COMES DOWN TO WHAT TEAM WANTS IT THE MOST AND WHO REALLY WANTS IT

JUST LOOK AT THE '07 GIANTS AND WHAT THEY DID IN THE PLAYOFFS LAST SEASON

I agree but in El Paso the majority of the student athletes do not take the offseason serious. Lack of strength and no stamina to hang with the farm boys of the panhandle

Here is concrete evidence for all of you "El Paso has too many schools" excuse makers. If El Paso had too many schools, would that not put their enrollment numbers below that of many other schools within the same classification? Let's look at class 5A for a moment...

Abilene High School from District 4-5A has an enrollment of 2,404. They finished 13-2 and reached the State Semifinal round of last season's Class 5A Division II playoffs. They are also 10-0 this season, and finished 4th in the Associated Press 5A Football Poll this regular season.

By comparison, Franklin (3,116), Montwood (2,669), Socorro (2,822), El Dorado (2,827) and Americas (2,877) all have enrollment greater than that of Abilene High yet none of the aforementioned schools have experienced a fraction of the success as have the Eagles.

Lee High School of Midland has an enrollment of 2,813. Midland has a population of 96,193 and has 5 high schools (Lee, MHS, Greenwood, Midland Christian and Trinity). That is one high school for every 19,239 people. According to recent estimates, El Paso's population is 598,590 and has 27 high schools. That is one high school for every 22,170 people. Lee has won 3 state championships since 1998 and Midland High made an appearance in the state finals in 2002, as did class 3A Greenwood.

That is not even to mention that Southlake Carroll has an enrollment of 2,544. Less than the El Paso schools mentioned above, and everyone knows the great amount of success achieved by the Dragons.

I think the community making excuses for failure has more to do with the lack of football success in El Paso than any other reason. But there is your evidence that "too many schools" is not a valid reason.

It all boils down to coaching

athletes...period.

What you are not saying about SOuthlake Carroll is that they have that population of nothing but juniors and seniors. They have a separate school for freshmen and sophomores that is not part of the population. So they technically have double the population of seniors and juniors.

What you are saying about Southlake Carroll is not true. They may have a high school for only juniors and seniors, but for enrollment purposes the UIL takes into account all students feeding into a particular high school from grades 9-12.

Midland's school district has a separate high school for freshmen but those students are factored into their enrollment numbers.

Same goes for all Texas high schools. Sorry, try another excuse.

We are not trying to make excuses, but at the end of the day that along with money, talent selection, coaching are factors of success. Why is it that your schools do not compare with the Dallas area, San Antonio and Houston area? Because they have more money, better coaching, and more talent selection. Please do not try to make a smart response because in the last 8 years or so, it has been one of those schools that went on to win state, which is what really matter after all.

I graduated from Permian. The reason we have not won a title is a poor coach that ruined the program in the mid-nineties and the program is just starting to rebuild. We have just as much money, talent, etc as the metroplex, Houston, etc, schools. It is only a matter of time. Permian is ranked #21 in the ESPN National poll so I think we are doing pretty well.

But when we are not successful, we do not make excuses. We try to find answers as to why we are not winning, and do whatever it takes to fix the problem. But to say that Midland/Odessa schools haven't won state in the last 8 years, and ask why... there are 4 5A programs in Midland/Odessa as compared to 22 in Houston alone, so of course they will win more championships. If I buy 4 lotto tickets and you buy 22 you obviously have a better chance to win than I do. It's the law of probability.

To ExWest Texan:
Do you not agree that the entire Permian community supports the Panthers? I grew up around there and played against Permian. It was amazing to see the support that the community gives the Panthers. It's like a college football atmosphere!! When ddo you ever see people in El Paso camping out for tickets or standing in line for hours just to get a chance to see a high school football team play? I was lucky enough to watch Permian play Lee this year, and I stood in line for four hours for a ticket. That's only after they opened some tickets up for standing room only!!! That I think is a major difference from what we have here in El Paso!! You don't see that type of support for our teams here!! The community does not revolve around our school sports!! Correct me if I am wrong, in Odessa, the city practically shuts down on Friday nights!! With that kind of support comes more money for the program, better coaches, and great student atheletes!! It all comes together!!

Standing room only tickets for lee permian this year? So far from the truth! I dont know where you stood in line for four hours blackout because the lee permian game didn't come anywhere close to selling out this year. I cant believe how delusional some of you guys are.

Sorry for the typo....it was Permian/Odessa High....

Blackout:

No I do not agree that the entire city of Odessa shuts down on Friday nights for high school football games. Odessa, including the surrounding area, comprises over 110,000 people. On the Friday of the Permian/Odessa High game there will be, at most, just over 20,000 in the stadium. Yes, that is a large audience for a high school game, but that leaves 90,000 people that are doing something else. But on a majority of Friday nights there are probably only in the neighborhood of 8,000 Odessans attending a high school football game.

The city does not shut down. There are not special hours at stores for Fridays in the fall. Everything stays open, it is exactly the same as it always is.

My original point was that El Pasoans need to stop blaming outside influences for their lack of success in football, i.e. too many schools. I provided facts to show that is certainly not the case.

Yes, most of the east side of Odessa supports Permian in one way or another. And community support helps. That is exactly my point. Those in El Paso that desire a successful program that can advance past the third round need to look in the mirror, and instead of making excuses, try to see what they, with the help of the community (boosters, alumni, etc), can do to make things better.

let me see if i can put this into perspective...going to state or deep in the playoffs is hard task...while many el pasoans do want a state championship why do we get bent out of shape that it hasn't happened, its a hard task...

other sports, TEAM sports are not making state or going deep into state, with the exception of a few (those that come to mind are Socorro Baseball and DV Soccer)...other than that, no other team sports are making a run

Coaching staff, lack of offensive schemes, and old school mentality.

we cant due to the fact of tooo many schools. too many schools means that all the talent has been spread out. yeah maybe there will be alot of students in the school and in a team but the talent will be HUGE! there is so much talent and great talent here in ep as there is in anywere else in TX! with all of these schools ep really doesnt stand a chance for state.

why do ppl keep using this excuse? it is a myth

maus i think it is young kids who do not know or have not read the previous messages and just type away.

I know. it just annoys me that so many ppl automatically fall back on an excuse like that, without having any proof to support it. for every successful magaschool they name that has like 5,000 kids, I can name at least 2 schools that do way better than ep teams despite having the SAME or SMALLER enrollment numbers. ppl see how a new high school pops up in ep every few years & immediately think they dilute the talent. yes that would be true IF our city's population remained the same. BUT our cities population is constantly growing. new schools aren't being built just for the heck of it. that'd be a waste of our school districts' meager funds. they're built because they are needed for a GROWING population. like I have mentioned before, last year, del valle and andress were the 2nd & 3rd biggest schools in terms of enrollment numbers in the entire 4a playoff bracket & look how far they got. just the area round.

This year, in Region 1 of the 4a division 1 playoffs, Del Valle had the 4th biggest enrollment, Chapin had the 6th biggest, Andress had the 8th biggest, & Canutillo had the 2nd smallest. Canutillo (1637) destroyed Andress (1831). Del Valle (1963) barely beat Chapin (1876) by 1, then got whooped 56-10 by Abilene Cooper (2048) who only had about 80 more students. Canutillo got whooped 48-7 by Frenship (1639) who only had 2 more students.

It gets worse. In Region 1 of the 4a division 2 playoffs, Austin was the 2nd biggest, Parkland was the 7th biggest, Burges was the 3rd biggest, and Riverside was the 4th biggest. Parkland (1302) beat Austin (1659), Riverside (1532) destroyed Burges (1589) 46-10. Then Big Spring (1060) destroyed Riverside 47-6, while having about 500 less students. of the 4 ep teams in this bracket, only Parkland, the smallest one, is still alive. & guess what? Parkland is the biggest school from region 1 left because Stephenville=1096 students, Big Spring=1060, and Everman=1159.

then ppl say that it's cuz certain schools have a split campus, but that's bs too, because the enrollments take that into account and add the enrollments of the 2 parts of the campus together to get the total enrollment.

The only place where numbers might be a little of a problem would be in 5a, especially division 1. but the fact that our ep 4a teams have numerical advantages yet still accomplish nothing, leads me to believe that there are more problems than enrollment #s, & those problems probly exist for our 5a schools too. school enrollment #'s are the only way to judge if the "we have too many schools" excuse holds any merit, & they have proved the myth to be completely busted.

Well, we are not suppose to talk about it. But in this day and age there is still stero typing of people, we harbor fear that comes with all that bolony. Until we face our fears and let go.We will have that cramp, blocking, slushing, grawning, and holding us down, like caring a block of ice, and covers on our eyes. Let the ice melt, remove the covers and see clearly. We are human just like every one else!!!!!!!! Must fight. The other reality is that the other parts of Texas have always look down on El Paso. Any time any of our teams past the Van Horn line, you better believe we have to really fight cuz they will always pull some bad calls, that want to make you cry. Prejudice still exsist, this is not an excuse just a reality. So when any of our teams are in. You know darn well they earned the win. Look at the make up of teams in El Paso. There you go, need I say more. I know you can figure out. Number aren't the problem.

Chips, Katy was built in 1898 and we now have 6 high schools in the Katy area with another one on the way and they all share the same stadium.
The excuse that too many schools spreads out the talent doesn't hold water with me. For the past 12 years Katy has always been a contender for the title and that is with new schools being built over here.
Katy also has summer camp for the kiddos still in grade school and an incoming freshman camp in the summer.
It is amazing to see a standing room only crowd every Katy game on the Katy side, the fans look forward to game day and get to the stadium hours before the gates open.
I think coaching, community involvement and the kids believing in one another are keys to a winning tradition.
With relaignment this year there were some good programs out there looking for games this year and Katy was one of those schools having a hard time finding 5 non district opponents.
If the coaches would get with their A.D.'s and booster clubs now and try to come up with a way to raise money and try and hook up with traditional powerhouses in the state, I am sure it would happen.
I believe that if one high school from EP would take that giant step and schedule a game in week zero against a SLC or a Katy, more would follow the following year, win or lose it would be a confidence builder for the rest of the year.
What do I know just my 2 cents worth.
Good luck to Parkland the rest of the way!!

I agree, tougher schedules with top ten teams..... like Montwood does.

MOntwood has made great strides!!!

great strides for their school but not for El Paso

well for one when you get teams like el dorado who have never gone to playoffs you got problems. they should have never gone,instead hanks should of gone. secondly, east texas teams are stronger, faster ,more dicplined over there they eat ,sleep football somthing our el paso teams lack

Case in point Parkland makes it to the 3rd Round and they don't even have an athletic period. Just imagine maybe what they could have done if they did. That is just another reason El Paso Teams struggle in the playoffs

I agree, I can actually see Montwood going to the state in a few years.

A big reason is when principals and athletic directors stop hiring their golf buddies and friends and hire the best person for the job the teams in el paso can only get better.

it's not just the enrollment numbers that go into account. it is also the number of players a team has. somebody mentioned on another thread on this site that stephenville had twice as many players suited out as parkland. that makes a difference. el paso schools just dont have the number of kids going out for football. we may have the same number of kids at the school, but east texas teams have 100 players on the team. teams from el paso may have 36 or 45. that is a huge difference. they have more big bodies, more depth, more "dedicated" football players.

there is plenty of talent in EL Paso, pat present and future. the problem is the seriouness that athletics and coaches take during the off season workout. you dont wait until two a day to start getting ready for the season, you work you butt off during the off season so when you do come in it to prepare with offensive and defensive plays. players east of el paso have more motivation to do better the following year.the schoold fb program must have more influence on getting the elpaso kids to work harder...fb is a year round sport...work on speed, attend camps, combines hit the weights harder...spend 3-4 hrs in the gym instead of playing videos and im pretty sure they will be competitive outside...so the talent is here, its the programs that need to improve

stealth El Paso has the talent, everyone knows that. Problem is that our local 6ft student athletes rather play basketball than participate in football. If you go to basketball games you will see these 6ft and taller student athletes on the court. Many of them do not participate in football.

Whether they are scared to get hit or simply prefer playing basketball than football its something to think about.

I for one believe that high school basketball players who do not participate in football should get involved. It will only raise their individual stock like it did for Chapins Cliff Tucker and is doing for Montwoods Chris Muncie.

Basketball players should participate. Better for them and their schools football program.

Good to see this topic is still getting replies after being posted Jan 1st, 2008

stealth I totally agree el paso has the same enrollment numbers as teams east of here but they have more players out for football and they take it more serious. You have big kids in El Paso but they don't play because parents don't push them to play after pop warner.

A lot of kids with size do not play and have never played because it is not what their parents or friends were into so they never got into it. They need to get drafted early. I know in High School the coaches will walk up to you in the halways and ask you if you are interested but do they do that in Junior High?

There are too many schools in el paso so the talent pool is diluted among all the schools. How many schools are in the permian basin? We don't have the population other schools around dallas, austin have where the talent pool is deep.

I don't think there ever will be an El Paso football team to play for the state title. We will have even more schools in the future.

Another factor that nobody likes to talk about is race, it's taboo but it is also truth. In general the vast majority of mexican-americans do not have the physical talent that most african-americans and many anglo kids do. I am a mexican american and played HS football in Coronado, I remember the time when we played Permina, some of those kids looked like they were already in college, just massive and strong. Heart is an important part of the game but like the saying goes, a good big man will almost always beat a good little man.

Why ep cant make it to state?


Beeing negative in reaching to state! people telling you you wont get passed the second round! ask JUCO he would know!

Thats true ... Imagine Andress Parkland Irvin And Chapin with one team ! but excuses are excuses well have to outwork outstudy and outgrind them east texas boys

This year, in Region 1 of the 4a division 1 playoffs, Del Valle had the 4th biggest enrollment, Chapin had the 6th biggest, Andress had the 8th biggest, & Canutillo had the 2nd smallest. Canutillo (1637) destroyed Andress (1831). Del Valle (1963) barely beat Chapin (1876) by 1, then got whooped 56-10 by Abilene Cooper (2048) who only had about 80 more students. Canutillo got whooped 48-7 by Frenship (1639) who only had 2 more students.

In Region 1 of the 4a division 2 playoffs, Austin was the 2nd biggest, Parkland was the 7th biggest, Burges was the 3rd biggest, and Riverside was the 4th biggest. Parkland (1302) beat Austin (1659), Riverside (1532) destroyed Burges (1589) 46-10. Then Big Spring (1060) destroyed Riverside 47-6, while having about 500 less students. of the 4 ep teams in this bracket, only Parkland, the smallest one, is still alive. & guess what? Parkland is the biggest school from region 1 left because Stephenville=1096 students, Big Spring=1060, and Everman=1159.

maus if those numbers are correct then the problem with El Paso high school football is the COACHING!!!!!!! No ands ifs or buts about it. We need better coaching with them getting paid better.

Rudy, I totally agree the problem is that it is that the process is too political the best coaches aren't being selected for these jobs and their is absolutely NO PRESSURE AT ALL TO WIN HERE IN EL PASO.

It is the coaching that is what it all boils down to. Coach Work won many district titles with not so great talent and he also coached not so great talent to the 3rd round of the playoffs. Coaching is horrible here in El Paso. Whether the players do not do this or do not do that it really boils down to coaching.

Viper I can't agree more, El Paso could be so much better if the right coaches were selected to run these programs not the principals favorite. I have read about how kids here aren't that dedicated to football, well those same kids grow to be coaches in this city. That is a vicious cycle. Coach Work I give him much credit because he didn't have chapin or andress talent and still accomplished great things.

You see that video on the home page of Epgridiron??? That shows that Montwood could put a hurt on those Dallas and Ft Worth teams. Sunday knocking out that DB and Swenson putting the hit stick on the QB. Guess what??? Montwood returns quite a few players, specially on defense and a few receivers.

I'm not sure how El Paso feeder schools work but in Odessa, Permian has 3 schools that feed directly to Permian... Those 3 schools teach the fundementals and terminology the way the Permian coaches want it taught... OHS has 3 schools that feed directly to OHS... Same thing applies... The kids start learning the terminology, the schemes, and the basics of the offense and defense at a young age so by the time they are a senior they've been doing it for 6 years... Permian fields 3 full teams (2 JVs and a Varsity) with probably 200 or so students in the program for 10-12 grade... In addition each feeder has a 9th grade only team... Participation is a HUGE factor for Permian... Coaching and Preparation are the other big factor... At Permian, there have been some poor coaches over the last 15 years... Mayes ran the program into the ground and Smith and Mills were not the answer, Allman brought back the work ethic and such of the historic Permian programs... When your kids work out hard year round, build themselves up and prepare to be the best, they reap the benefits... Start building programs instead of teams and your victory totals and playoff runs will improve...

I know for a fact that some of the enrollment # up in the panhandle school only acount for 10, 11, and 12 grades! some have 9th grade centers and others have there 9th graders in the junior high...My nephew attends one of those schools.

You are wrong, the UIL when counting enrollment counts grades 9-12, check the UIL website realignment procedures are out there.

that's the excuse everyone uses but I'm pretty sure enrollment #'s take that into account. Franklin's enrollment is listed at 3116 because they add both the centers @ Franklin and Hornedo together. Southlake Carroll is listed as 2544.5 & when you go to the Southlake ISD website they list the enrollment for the Carroll High as 1309 & Carroll Senior High as 1279 (equaling 2588 total, differences probly resulting from a few new tranfers). so the numbers in the enrollment list added both campuses together. so do you know for a fact that the enrollment numbers aren't added together, or do you just know for a fact that there are split campuses? alot of ppl in El Paso hear the stories about the split campuses & automatically assume that the enrollment numbers aren't added together, which is not the case.

i can see your point, lobo and viper. coach work did not have as much talent as chapin, andress or even parkland--but riverside has had many, many talented kids go thru it's program. they may not have been d--1 caliber players, but they were fantastic athletes. guys like william buffington, mike flores, javi quintana, mike herrera, carlos carillo, omar ferniza, robert hood, jeremy, jamie and shawn jordan, mike stephenson, jesse bustamante, robert gallegos, tony gonzalez, johnny sanchez, leo baca, etc, etc have been among the elite football players here in el paso. you cannot win as much as tom work did with mediore talent. but you are correct it took a great coach to put it all together. the entire city of ep lost when work decided to retire.

If it makes you feel any better... El Paso basketball teams are putting a beating on Panhandle and even beating Dallas Fort Worth teams in basketball. Montwood just beat the best team from Oklahoma and Hanks beat Grand Praire. All EP teams have been winning thus far in the Dallas tournaments.

El Paso teams fare well in hoops..dunno if anyone is at the North Crowley or Duncanville level but Montwood impressed me last year

Believe MOntwood is at North Crowley level who won state last year... Last year in playoffs North Crowley beat Montwood in overtime and had to throw up a prayer to even get to overtime and went on to win state. Montwood just won again today and will play the championship game tomorrow. Montwood seems to be the only school representing El Paso well.

1. Number of coaches
2. Quality of coaches
3. Size and speed
4. Community support
5. Poor middle school feeder system
6. Lack of enough quality athletes in any ony school

I think you mean "lack of enough quality athletes that try out for football"

I left something out. Not having your athletes everyday in athletics.

First off, congrats to all the schools that represented EP in the playoffs this year. I was surprised to see 5a 's exit early this year, 4a did real well this year.
Now to the topic, last years Katy squad graduated 60 + seniors, leaving only a handfull with varsity expierence. Katy started the season off with a 10-6 loss to North Shore, then got an ass whooping by The Woodlands 47-0, Katy dropped out of the state and greater Houston rankings and people wrote them off. The players did a lot of soul searching and put alot of hard work in there after. They won their next 7 games and lost to Cinco Ranch for the district crown in OT. Final regular season record was 7-3, not what folks from Katy are accustomed to but the Katy fans never gave up on them boys.

North Shore, The Woodlands and Cinco Ranch are out of the playoffs, the same teams Katy lost to earlier in the year. Its not how you start the year, its how you end it. While folks from Cinco were printing district champion shirts and wearing them proudly, Katy was getting after it on the practice fields trying to get better for the playoffs.
You have to WANT it, to FEEL it, to BELIEVE it.
Katy has fought and clawed its way back to the semis and have done it with players that wanted it and have stepped up, MANY of who are soph's. Like I stated earlier in the year, coaching has alot to do with it but if you have a bunch of slackers, a coach can only do so much.
Ya'll don't give up on your schools and your city, I still believe EP is on the verge of a breakout, if ya'll get a chance, take that 11 hour drive east to H-Town for the 5A Texas Bowl on Dec 20th.


Happy Holidays EP!

Great read ex elpasoan

Super Post Ex, but Katy had 60 seniors, El Paso teams are lucky to have 60 players on a Varsity and JV team.

A lot of those Katy and Allen seniors are D-1 caliber players. They will be playing at the next level! Here in El Paso, a team is lucky to have one D-1 prospect!! It's a big deal here. Those schools that win championships and get deep into the playoffs have those types of players year after year. that comes from hard work and dedication on the kids part as well as the coaching staff!! We don't have that here in our city. The mindset has to change here before you will see El Paso teams competing with everyone else in the state. Can you imagine Eastwood playing Katy in a state semifinal or final???

Katy's 2007 squad was loaded with talent, heres the breakdown:
1 UCLA
2 Texas AM
1 South Carolina/transfer to Kansas State
1 Rice
1 Air Force Academy
1 SMU
8-10 D-2 and JUCO'S
others could have gone on but weren't offered
2008 squad won't have nearly half that many offers.
After Katys 2008 march to the title, I believe that good coaching, hard work, teamwork, EXECUTION, community support, and luck every now and then gets the job done.
I read EPGRIDIRON to keep up with my hometown, I enjoy most of what I read here because like me ya'll enjoy high school football. There is nothing like high school football in Texas.
To the players that get on here, off season should have already started, you have 8 months to get ready.
You only get one shot at high school, how bad do you want it?
I extend an invitation to anyone willing to make a Katy game next fall, I still have my season tickets even though my son graduated from the '07 Katy squad.
Keep up the good reads here and hope ya'll have a safe and happy new year!!

some say the 4--A austin lake travis cavaliers were the best high school team in texas last season. they prbably were. take a look at the size of their starting line up. no team in el paso can measure up. these out of town teams have too many big, strong, athletic players on their team. football is a game where size matters. the cavaliers starting qb stood 6'4, their two best recievers were over 6'3 how can any ep team counter that size difference? these guys are not just big, but fast and athletic---that's obvious--they're state champions in the state of texas!

Teams in El Paso cannot make it to state beause they have no heart, they just give up when they are losing and teams from east texas they don't ever give upp they find a way to win.

I totally disagree, they dont have the heart?!!!!! boy are you wrong! who are you to say that! you dont know! many players play with all their heart and soul...so if you dont win, does that mean you guys didnt play with your heart?... that comment is just wrong boy!

drop the "t" in can't.
It starts with BELIEVING YOU CAN!

I live in Austin now and have followed my kids high school football for a couple of years now. It's not difficult to see the difference in talent and numbers. The kids are generally bigger and faster, not to mention that the big name local schools such as Lake Travis and Westlake have programs (like Permians) with great coaching staffs (that get paid lots of money). I don't think it's impossible for an EP team to make state. But a lot of factors would have to align for it to happen... I always look and hope that each year it happens. I've seen a couple of El Paso teams compete in baseball here in state and Riverside made it in BaketballBall in the 90s (in 5A!!! no less).

Most el paso teams do have alot of talent but one thing alot of kids are lacking is commitment and a desire to win. to most of them football is just a game its nothing more than that

I personally think there is just not too much talent here in El Paso and that is in part due to the fact that they can't win state which brings us back to the problem. How many players who are really talented would like to move into a school who barely reaches the 2nd round of playoffs? I think that out here in El Paso football is not taken as seriously as it is out in east texas. Those kids have talent because football has been their family's life for a long time and they know they have to take it seriously football is in their blood. Everyone is invloved. They take the off-season seriously because they know they have to and they get even better. Here the kids start drinking and don't do anything at all until the summer but the parents usually don't care while somewhere out in the east those kids start working on their strength and speed one week after their last game. It is not all about size, it is more about speed once you are in the playoffs. All those other teams are far better conditioned and simply faster then the ep kids. Speed is the most important factor and it has to be the entire team not just a couple of players but ep simply doesn't have it so they need to start working on it since the kids are young. All that is needed is COMMITMENT from everyone and maybe someday we will get a state championship for EP.

I too am an outsider. But judging from the responses of some these posts, size and speed seem to be the only solutions to winning the grand prize. I agree to a point, but it's not necessarily the answer.
I grew up and played in the permian basin. Coached as well. Expectations are always high no matter where you're from. kids in Odessa grow up eating, drinking, sleeping, etc., you get it, FOOTBALL!! And with expectations, comes pressure to win! The good kind of pressure, and that's good for everyone. And it takes everyone from the town bum to the highest ranked official to make it happen as well!! Kids in odessa can't wait to be a panther! Being part of what drives them, THE MOJO TRADITION!! And it's the same in midland, monahans, andrews, sweetwater, snyder, pecos, alpine, kermit, and many other permian basin communities as well. It's a belief. It's something you can't see or touch, but what you feel that drives these people to be successful, and on top of that, it's passed on from generation to generation. The passion is high, and it will always weigh more than size and speed. Now add that with the passion and expectations, and it's only a plus! If you take someone with the size and speed, but he has not the desire and passion of the rest, then guess what, he will always lose to the one who feels it more...

I'll go back to the size and speed issue... I grew up watching many a permian playoff games and state championship runs. And believe me or not, permian was always outsized and out gunned by most of the teams they played. Most teams had 8-9 D-1 players on their rosters, to maybe 1 for permian. The only differnce was that permian wouldn't stand for losing to anyone! They played with more desire and heart, and took it to their opponents. It came down to playing their rules and technique to perfection and executing! And the tradition of winning was always on their side!
This past season, I drove to texas stadium to watch permian play the Allen Eagles. Allen eventually went on to win the state championship in the Div.1 playoffs. The game before permians was ennis lions. They are a 4A team from the dfw area. It was the 3rd round of the playoffs. When permian came out onto the field, some of the ennis fans who stuck around, laughed and asked if that was a j.v. team out there?! On the other hand, allen had kids that stood 6ft 7 inches tall, 280-330 lbs, I mean they looked like a college team.In fact they had 8 D1 players on the team. Their running back is going to Ohio State. Permian only had 1 D1 player, a lineman whose last name is Porter, who is going to Texas.
Well to make a long story short, allen jumped on permian early, and went into halftime with a 14 0r 17 point lead. Well after making their halftime adjustments, permian made their storied comebacks. In the 4th quarter with less than 3 mins left in the game, permian had a 4th and 5 from the 50 yrd line. The play came 1INCH short from a first down! ONE INCH!! This to the eventual state champs!! Everyone in the stadium knew if permian had gotten that first down, they were gonna go on to win the game. They lost something like 27-22. But my point is, Yes size and speed is good, but it's NOT everything!! Permian took it to them, and they didn't back down, coming so close to winning. And again, it was disappointing as well. They didn't want to hear, well you guys made it this far, or at least they didn't beat you guys that bad, it's not what they want to hear, it's because THEY EXPECTED TO WIN THE GAME!!!!!!!!!!!
Of course it takes a great offseason to get to the promised land, I'm sure that ONE INCH is part of the drive that is motivating the kids to even work harder this offseason to a state championship.
There are alot of factors, but believing you are champion, walking and talking like one, and the biggest one of all, working like a champion will get you there. Not wishing, but making it happen. Are the kids in ep working that hard in their offseason programs, or are taking easy thinking they have plenty of time from now till 2adays or spring ball begins. I guarantee you guys one thing, those kids out east aren't...

Razor you talk smack like if you knew every single player in EP. If you think teams, over there at your hometown are better than everyone else, then go and cheer your team instead of wasting your time being negative and giving off bad vibes. Go watch your "elite" team throw- up inside the trash cans during practice. You gave your opinion and now I'm giving mine. Believe me there are other great teams out there that think that the so call Elite teams you mentioned are not that great. You see, there will always be someone better than you. This is a fact of life and if you think that putting other teams down make you the better man you are wrong, it only shows how cocky and how full of yourself you really are. Why not inspire and give constructive criticism instead of comparing and giving negative remarks. Like I said, go cheer your team cause we sure as hell are cheering for all our EP teams...

RAZOR 15 knows that El Paso football is on the rise and it frightens him. He is like ex president G W Bush who is trying to instill fear and his nonsense to the people. Lubbock teams and Panhandle teams are losing to El Paso teams more consistently than ever before. That is fact. True there is still lots of work to do but big strides have been made in the last 6 years compared.

RAZOR 15 is one bitter individual who only sees the empty half of the glass.

Saw the game and Mongo- The blind leading the blind!! How was my post negative?! I gave an example of how you can overcome obstacles such as size and speed with heart and dedication like permian did vs. a very big and fast allen team. Again, this is way your heads, stick to the pee wee's so you can live your dreams through little kids and tell them how good you were in high school and all!
You guys just have no clue! It really is funny! I think the bitter one's are you guys. You cant take the truth when it comes to ep football! It is what it is, sorry. EP is on the rise, but is it on a rise that closing the gap? I don't think so. EP is way behind the times, that's why this very topic is being discussed. Either accept it and try to understand and learn, or counter with an intelligent solution. Is that possible from you guys?! I've yet to hear your versions... So let's hear them!

Simply amazing that this Razor a k a east football fanatic thinks he is a intelligent and sensible person. Razor if you think El Paso football is so bad then why do you even bother discussing El Paso football or even think El Paso football. Why waste your energy if you are not a El Paso football fanatic??? Razor my advice to you is to stop coming to this El Paso football website and go find a east Texas city message board to discuss east Texas city football. Razor it would be perfect for you because those people out east Texas will most likely agree with you and your way of thinking..

My friend Razor 15 please be kind enough to share with us your step by step solution as to how to achieve success in the playoffs and reach the State Championship.

Do not only share with your step by step secret to success on the football field for just El Paso high school football teams but for all high school football teams throughout the United States?

My friend enlighten me Mr.Razor and share with all Americans as to what a program should do in order to guarantee them high school football playoff success and how to acquire State Championship status on a consistent basis.

Razor 15 when you provide your solution it would be very wise of you to write and publish a book thereafter. A step by step book on how to be successful in the high school football playoffs and how to get to the State Championship consistently.

My friend when you publish your book you can then make a video and sell your tapes, dvd or downloads as to how to be successful in the high school football playoffs and get to the State Championship consistently.

Razor 15 when you have published your book and produced as well as distributed your step by step dvd then you can begin to travel throughout the United States hosting clinics and instructing high school football coaches as well as college coaches as to how to be successful at American Football.

My friend once you accomplish all of that then you can walk and talk as if you think you know how to obtain success on the football field.

I myself will stick to supporting local football through thick and thin. No matter what.

I AM FULL OF EL PASO PRIDE.

Well Gotta Light, I think that book has already been written. It obviously hasn't made it's way out here to ep. Maybe it's been rejected by the very people with your mentality! You make it seem that I was the one who started this topic! It was started from someone who lives and breathes ep football. You guys reject my opinions because I'm an outsider and it seems to hurt your pride. You obviously don't have an answer as to the problems, but what you do have is plenty of pride, and that's good, but not good enough.
I can sure say without a doubt that I know more about this topic than you do. I've given my opinions and solutions, I don't think Ive seen you give one from yourself. What I have seen from you is trying to rally the fans of ep to be more united and supportive of ep football, which was one of my problems I said ep has. EP doesn't support ep football!! I've just compared it to the east, but you guys don't like it, even though it's the truth! I think your head is in the right place, but what are you doing about it? Are you out in the community spreading your pride? Are you a part of your team's booster club? Do you attend school board meetings and express your concerns to them in order to bring changes to ep football? But My biggest question to you is, do you know what it takes to build a program? Would you know what to bring to the table to get things started? What changes would have to be made in order to make ep football a power amongst the rest of the state? If you had the power, what changes would you make? Or are you just one of those that sits back and wishes things were different, yet brings your sarcastic and negative attitude towards someone who at least gives his honest opinion to the subject. That's why it's called a discussion board... I think you're a sensible man with his heart in the good direction, but don't blame the outside world for the problems you have here in ep.

And Razor, in your hometown there can only be ONE winner, so does that mean that everyone else didn't play hard enough, or was it that they stayed home and did nothing? Or was it that they didn't play with their hearts? In your opinion are they all loosers or did they not practice hard enough? DID they not wanted to win? Because this is what you are saying is the problem here in EP... Or did their community didn't support them as well?

Razor, regardless of our difference of opinions there can only be one winner, like it or not. I have the outmost respect to ANY team that gives it their all, and even if you come last, you get back up and never give up. And you learn from your mistakes and make strides... and that my friend is what EP IS DOING......sO, LIKE I SAID BEFORe, GO EP GO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Saw the game- I give up... Maybe someone who shares at least some of my opinions can better get through to you. In my opinion, this is just way too over your head for you to understand. In the permian basin, the same amount of teams make the playoffs as well like ep teams. And I never called anyone a loser! You just take everything so literal, that you make this hard. I just merely gave you a taste of what it's like for kids growing up in the permian basin when it comes to football. It's a mentality that can't be explained unless you've experienced it... That's all...
But again, you still haven't given me your solutions to why ep can't go to state...

We have way too many schools in a such a short radius which puts many good players playing for different schools, therefore talent is so spread out that schools constantly loose players because now they belong to another school, teams have to be 100% committed but they also need financial support and better equipment. We need to motivate our kids to be involve in sports at early ages eventhough realistically speaking EP has very low paying jobs which for many parents make it extremely hard to be involved when they work 12 or more hour shifts. EP is one of the lowest payed citys and schools have very little funds, I'm not making excuses , I just want you to open mindedly see how hard it is for teams to have good coaching, god training supplies, and money to support our teams. Hell sometimes we barely have food to put in our tables but things are getting better and thats why teams are also getting better. You may have the desire, dedication, determination but sometime this is not all you need, you need more than this ( you need better coaching, better equipment and more school funds) Since were so close to the border, unemployment rates are so high and whatever jobs there are are not well- payed. My point being-kids find after schools jobs to help out and still find time to be dedicated to football. I don't know how to solve this on going obsticles, but i do know it's not right to say "they don't work hard enough" "they dont practice hard enough" "they don't want it badly" because they do and i applaud their efforts and i am optimistic things will get better and we are very proud to be the underdogs and we still keep fighting and never give up.........

There is some good talent here. The three reasons why teams have not been successful are #1. "Overall" team committment and coach enforced participation in off season strength and conditioning programs. #2. Implementation of strength and conditioning programs that actually work. #3. and probably the most important is an inferiority complex that has fermented in El Paso about competing against out of town team from Midland/Odessa on east. In these games, our local teams don't usually figure out that they are able to compete until it's too late to try to comeback. (except Montwood)

In my opinion, the way El Paso area can win state is to contract a good head coach for four years, build a team from freshman year and keep that same team throughout the four years. Keep football practices throughout the summers between school years, or start practicing earlier. In addition, have an all-district policy that football players attend the last class period as a physical education class, which will serve as a warm-up, and start practicing drills and plays right after school. Team discipline, coaches included, needs to be enforced without any exceptions.

um alot of teams already do that stuff. usually, it is not necessary to "contract" a coach for 4 years. they stay way longer than that anyway.

"build a team from freshman year and keep that same team throughout the four years"-check (most teams in the city do this).

"Keep football practices throughout the summers between school years, or start practicing earlier"-check (the good teams in ep have offseason & 7-on-7 for the duration of the year outside of the season).

"an all-district policy that football players attend the last class period as a physical education class, which will serve as a warm-up, and start practicing drills and plays right after school."-check (well, idk if there is a district policy requiring it, but we did all that at chapin & Im sure tons of other schools do that as well).

I agree

Not to hurt feeling but I live out here in the basin and I am a El paso player from back in the day, and it is flat out coaching and the preparing of the games for the play offs as well as adjusting at half time. How is it that most el paso team are either winning or down by 3 to 7 point at half then all of a sudden get blown out. COACHING!! Talent is there. Not to brag but I have played in and practiced with pros in the NFL,CFL AFL,IFL and my talent was and is up there. I see these El Paso teams in the playoffs and as a team and individuals they are far more skilled than I ever was. El paso teams have gone further now in the play offs and upsetting teams which i credit to better coaching but to be on a state level we have to play at a state level which means coaches players bring the "A" game even during home coming! I am in the locker room of PErmian High school to Odessa high and in midland and it is talented coaches making adjustment all the time to everything.

Well then ep coaches are not getting the job done at the half. NO adjustments or what?? THey are leading and play to protect the lead or they are down and get blown out???

50 years of crappy coaching... you got yourself a real problem.

Coaching is a big part of the problem but not the only problem. Players are not taking their offseason serious. Look at El Paso basketball, El Paso soccer, and El Paso baseball. They are going deep in the playoffs. Talent is here in El Paso but as someone stated on this board. Linemen have to beef up because that is where the difference is at and that is where El Paso teams are getting beat at.

I'd have to say that yes, there is some bad coaching in ep, but for the most part, ep has some very good head coaches. The big picture, the bigger problem in ep is the the system and the mentality. The administrators in ep have no clue and no idea as to how a program should be run. Principals have too much power over athletics and that's what kills programs. They are soooo behind the times it's embarrassing. And this as well, handcuffs the good coaches that ep does have. Like I said in another post, Look at the Permian/Austin Westlake situation. Coach Allman from Permian goes to Westlake and is being paid $120K to coach at Westlake. He and his staff are being offered the world to insure that Westlake will always be in contention for a state championship year in and year out. Does ep have this type of mentality? I know it's alot of money, but how can ep compete and win when other's out east have the support of their administration and are given what they need to succeed, even at schools that aren't paying the 6 digit figures, while ep only thinks about being the best in ep? EP needs to hire administrators out of ep that are football minded and will stand up to those that want to keep things the same, and make drastic changes to what hasn't worked for many years in ep. Until that happens, this topic will go on for many more years. EP has to make FOOTBALL KING and the most important sport in ep.

Razor is intuitive and makes great points... however, I would argue that school boards and superintendents do understand what it would take but either choose not to take those steps or can't afford to take those steps because they have other issues they deem more pressing.

qwert,
I disagree. I think the administrators and school board members in ep really don't have a clue, and don't care about football and athletics as a whole. I think they feel since it's a part of the curriculum, they do just enough. Look around at most facilities and game fields. Not very nice. Not much care and thought put into these facilities. Stands on only one side of the stadiums, grass fields not maintained well, etc., etc., etc.
Also, money isn't really the issue. I know for a fact that the coaching stipens in ep are higher than those in the permian basin. So coaches in ep make more money coaching. The difference is the mentality and the urgency to bring championships to ep. Everyone can talk about how good and talented their teams are, but what is being done to get to the next level?
I know there are alot of fans, parents, coaches, and kids that get on this website, but my one big question to you all is this, why is there not more pressure being put on Superintendents and School Board Members to make changes for the betterment of ep football and facilities? This is the backbone to it all. Making them accountable will bring back answers that you guys have been waiting for for many years! Make football an issue in ep. Put people who really want to see ep football succeed an compete on the state level, on the school boards. I know people have said ep is poor and other things, but trust me guys, ep is no poorer than towns east of here. It's just a mentality that ep doesn't have. It can get done, and it's not as hard as you think. Programs that have been down for years have become power programs just with the change of ways, and giving good quality coaches a real chance to compete and build great programs. Some in a matter of one season... The formula is not that difficult. But you the fans have to start making your voices heard where it matters, and that's at board meetings and in the offices of these supts. that are supposed to be working for YOU!! If you limit your concerns and opinions to a message board, then nothing will ever be done...

Points taken. Well stated.

Razor you are right all the pieces are here to compete at a high level outside of el paso, but the coaching overall isn't good and coaches who don't do well are kept in place for years. Andress has as much talent as anyone in El Paso and the Permian Basin and they can't get to the playoffs or lose in the first round to another el paso team. That mentality as a whole hurts all of el paso.

I agree with the Andress bit. Andress should have won or atleast made several state championship appearances. Boils down to coaching. Need to get those kids straight and focused 110%

Razor,
Some of them don't get it. Send me a Permian hat and I'll send you a Katy hat.

plain and simple way too many schools
el paso talent is too watered down

plain and simple way too many schools!

el paso talent is too watered down
now imagine if schools combine the other talent would force athletes to try harder to get a starting spot or keep their starting spot and make the athletes better. every team would be tougher
district games would be just as tough as playoff

ex. lubb estacod had the worst record and beat austin but they played teams like lubb coronado Monterrey etc etc thay were well prepared or tough team

less shcools= el paso makes it to state

lol :p,
Your concept is way too unrealistic and old. If el paso were to eliminate schools, where would the rest of the kids go? Either you'd have enrollments of 6-10 thousand per school, which would not jive with u.i.l., or the solution would be to build more schools, which is already happening. Face it, ep is growing, and by that, don't you think ep has an advantage because it has more to choose from? The "ep has too many schools" is a cop out and over ran excuse! Look at all the DFW, Houston, San Antonio, Austin school districts, they too have many schools, and yet are successful and competitive year in and year out. Your problem here in ep is, THE BACKWARDS MENTALITY AND YOUR ADMINISTRATION!!

IM gonna let it out plain and simple

the rest of texas sees us as a joke

how do i know this? cause i play wit guys from Beaumont, San Antonio, and other cities from that region.. the reason? we dont work as hard as they do.. im sorry to say it.. that and many of them move ito districts to stronger and better programs..

The reason an El Paso school will not make it to state anytime soon is because you guys are in the toughest region in the entire state!!!!! Until you start getting the same talent as Dallas and half of Houston you will never get past the 2nd round. Sad but true.

FYI some El Paso teams have been past the second round several times in the last 6 years.

That is correct

2001 Del Valle beat Abilene to advance to the 3rd round of the Playoffs

2003 Riverside beat Amarillo Palo Duro to advance to the 3rd round of the Playoffs

2004 Riverside beat Canyon Randall to advance to the 3rd round of the Playoffs

2005 Franklin beat Mansfield Summit to advance to the 3rd round of the Playoffs

2005 Chapin beat Big Spring to advance to the 3rd round of the Playoffs

2006 Chapin beat Hereford to advance to the 3rd round of the Playoffs

2008 Parkland beat San Angelo Lakeview to advance to the 3rd round of the Playoffs

3rd round is the bench mark for El Paso, most teams from EP who make it to the third round get DESTROYED. No EP team has gotten past round 3 EVER.

It's going to take a special team to break the jinx.

Matthew328 you are incorrect. Chapin actually lost by 7 to Aledo in the 3rd round in 2005.

In addition to that El Paso teams are getting to the 3rd round alot more consistently this new millennium than in that last century.

Times are changing for El Paso football. Getting past the 2nd round of the playoffs has become a habit for El Paso football teams.

The problem is that dorks are ignoring the facts because they have a need for more success from El Paso teams. I guarantee you when an El Paso team gets to the 4th round dorks are going to be asking for the 6th round and ingore the fact that the 4th round was accomplished.

Dorks always want more and are never satisfied no matter what. Even when an El Paso team gets to state there will be those dorks who will say that the El Paso team had and easy playoff trail.

Try this non-district schedule;
Katy starts off this fall with North Shore, The Woodlands, Bellevue, Wa(Wa. State Champs), Flower Mound Marcus and Beaumont Westbrook.

North Shore will also play Southlake Carroll
The Woodlands will play North Shore.

Does anyone from Soccoro know if they will scrimmage Permian in Ep or Odessa this year?

Coaching skill is a factor. I have seen numerous playoff games close at half-time, only to be a blowout by the end of the game. These are what I figure as the "out-coached" games.

The talent mismatch games are apparent for the whole game. These are the beatings that are gonna happen no matter how good the coach. I would place 05 Franklin-Euless, and 04 Riverside-Wichita Falls into the beating category.

Watch the assistant coaches on both sides of the field during a game. I have noticed significantly more "coaching" on the non-El Paso teams sidelines. Some of the El Paso assistant coaches are watching the game like any other person with a sideline pass.

Take it from a coach who has coached in Texas for 13 years outside of El Paso. SUPPORT FROM ADMINISTRATION IS THE PROBLEM FOR EL PASO HIGH SCHOOL FOOTBALL.

FIRST lets be realistic. There are areas in Texas where everything is based around high school football. Metroplex areas in Dallas have money, talent, coaching, everything to put them in position to succeed. It is that way in suburbs of Houston, San Antonio and Austin. FLAT OUT, More talent, better coaching and more money! The sad part is, El Paso is a very big city and there is money, talent and good coaches here. Just not the support to put it all together.

SECOND, Lack of support from administrators. If you look at El Paso High School football there are three 5-A teams in 1-5A that do not have scouting software. Bel-Air, Hanks and Eastwood. Believe me, those are the only schools in 5-A Texas that don't have that. The El Paso ISD and Socorro ISD schools have it but only until recently. My longtime friend Phil Lopez at Bel-Air can not hire coaches because his principal won't make jobs available for him. He almost had to run through fire to bring the two coaches be brought. most of his other coaches are all coaches from the previous staff. Other schools go through the same thing. To win you need an administration that will bring in who you want, give you athletic class every day with all your staff. Digital editing systems, endzone cameras, coaches that understand how to run a program and you need to pay better. Assistants in Ysleta ISD get paid very well compared to the rest of the state. Head Coaches in Ysleta ISD are not paid well. Coach Davis (the new coach at San Angelo Central) is making like 90,000 a year! EL Paso head coaches are making in the 60's and 70's (maybe more in Socorro ISD). How can you attract great coaches here paying that? The good coaches that are here are either from here or were fired somewhere else. JUST FLAT TELLING IT LIKE IT IS. Lopez is the only one that i know that has ties across the state and that is in El Paso on his own merrit (and that won't be for long if they don't get behind him-sad thing is, the alumni don't think he is doing a good job). Go figure! Now Put together that packadge i told you about and take it to Eldorado or Parkland where there is talent. You will see EL Paso teams go furthur than they ever have. Montwood is a good example. They are still just scratching the surface. They can do more. Parkland can do more. Chapin can do more. Andress can do more. There are some talented teams and programs but the total packadge must be placed there. I think it could happen. But you need to remember, as soon as you get high enough you need to play Allen and Carrol and teams like that. Those teams have 7 to 10 division one players on them. How many D-1 players were signed out of EL Paso this year? 3! I think there are more out there but the programs must be in place. It can happen but leadership needs to allow it to happen. Kids in El Paso deserve a fair shot!

AMEN BROTHER!! I'm glad someone else has the same conclusion as mine. The pieces are here, but the same ol' concept and mentality for ep football continues by the ep ADMINISTRATION!!! Like I've always said, YOU'RE ONLY AS GOOD AS YOUR ADMINISTRATION... Good post Observer, and again seen from an outsider who knows better...

Let's just hope some administrators see this. Also, Football coaches in El Paso must stick together. An El Paso High School Coaches Association is a good idea. The Texas association is a must. You need to start working together to direct some change. From Chuck at Montwood to the young Brooks at Canutillo. Everyone must get togeher and make proposals. A summit with local principals. You can bring in principals from outside el paso. Coaches from outside. I would invite superintendents from Ysleta, El Paso and Socorro ISD's. Clint too. El Paso is the fastest growing city in West Texas. It is a great time to live there and I believe it is only a matter of time till a future team makes history and knocks another wall down.

Administrators do see this.

Why do you think new turf was installed at several stadiums in El Paso.

Why do you think fieldhouses were constructed.

Coaches received pay raises.

Coaches positioned as Athletic directors.

In the past 3 to 5 years El Pasoans began to demand immediate and positive action from their administrators. Things are finally getting done. El Pasoans have awaken from their sleep.

Great idea!! Who will take the first step to getting the ball rolling?! The coaches, the fans, an administrator who might be reading this, or possibly... NO ONE?! Let's see ep supporters, observer has a great idea, will you guys make a summit of coaches, administrators, and fans, a reality. I think it's a great start and will allow for all kinds of input...

Thompson,
I see what has begun in ep, but it's a mere drop in the bucket for ep football. Like Observer and myself have said, Head coaches need more. They have to uncuff them and give them more of what they need. Facilities, video/scouting equipment, coaches that they want to bring in, better pay for some, less class loads, more athletic periods in the day, a say with the feeder programs, support from principals and administration, free reign to run their program like they want (hire and fire coaches), and the list goes on and on. In most districts, coaches sign a dual contract. Which means their teaching and coaching assignments go together. If a coach is let go or decides they don't want to coach anymore, then not only is the coaching position available, but the teaching position as well. Too many times coaches are let go only to stay and hold up that teaching position. You have a coaching position open, but no teaching position, so your head coach is coaching with possibly a coach or 2 short for what he needs. And this is where the principal and the administration has to help out...
If ep administration would loosen the pockets a little, much could get done for ep football, but there has to be a true change of mentality and a full effort to move forward and close the gap to the rest of the state...

I totally agree.

Coaches must come together now for the city of El Paso is growing at light speed pace. Soon approximately 50,000 or more military families will be calling El Paso home and an abundance of talent will be present in El Paso unlike it has ever seen or experienced in its history.

El Pasoans were given a tiny glimpse of this last season with El Dorado's immediate success with them making the playoffs. An El Dorado team which mainly consisted of Sophomores and in Class 5A mind you. This is clear evidence that it has begun with many more on the way!!!!

Coaches the time to organize is now and in a positive way not corrupt like Old El Paso. Which El Paso coaches will begin this charge to excellence for the sake of our local high school football programs and especially for the sake of the youths of El Paso?

Coaches wait no more. Stop procrastinating and begin taking steps. A small step is better than not taking a step at all. A phone call will go a long way. Talking about eveyday will go even a longer way. Meeting and talking about will go even further. Get it in motion now and being prepared when it totally hits El Paso will be priceless.

Time to prepare El Paso high school football for its long overdue Glory!!! Former players did not bleed and sweat for nothing. There efforts will not go unoticed.

My friends there is a reason why El Paso was a doormat to the rest of Texas; that's because it will soon reign supreme tomorrow and for many years after that. Turning the page to a whole new chapter in El Paso high school football while making out of town teams their doormat to the several State Titles.

The time of reckoning is upon us. Open your eyes and see. It has begun.

How about you guys have a Gridiron meeting. All who post on here could meet at a restaurant or a sports bar and organize something. Then take your ideas to the more prominent coaches in ep. This will show these coaches that they have the support of you guys, which in turn will put pressure on the these lazy and behind the times administrators to finally do something!

I nominate, Gotta Light to head this off and get it going!!

I wan't to point out that some principals are doing a much better job than others (some schools have it horrible here in town). I would like to mention that those schools are providing more support are the ones that are having much more success. PARENTS: These issues need to be brought up to upper administration. Parents of student athletes need to push this issue because you put coaches (who are district employees) in very uncomfortable situations. There is no excuse. Get board members involved. Parents have the power. Coaches can communicate with administrators and provide a blue print for them to follow. I know those in Ysleta ISD are very optomistic because their new superintendent had previously been in Brownsville ISD. Anyone who is familar with Brownsville will tell you that they have top notch facilities and schools support their coaches and their missions. Also coaches with this new support will come higher expectations and pressure. Produce or get out. Other parts of Texas, coaches who can not show progress or quaity programs do not last very long. You must give coaches everything they need for success and then judge the success.

In my opinion Administrators should see it as an opportunity and give the coaches more resources to win. Whether its more pay. No more teaching history or any course. Some or all control over the middle school football teams.... etc... etc...

Administrators should face the fact that El Paso is a very large city but seems like a small Texas town in the middle of nowhere. There is really nothing to do here than to eat eat and eat some more. Restaurants at every corner. Utep football sucks. Yeah I said and I'll say it again. Utep football sucks. Diablos baseball is a joke. Yeah I said and I'll say it again. Diablos baseball is a joke. Western Playland? You call that an amusement park? Another joke!!!!

El Paso is a Texas city which seems and is run like a small Texas town. Administrators need to modernize their high school football programs for this is really the burning fire of El Paso and the true burning fire of Texas.

Bring El Paso football programs up to par with the rest of Texas.

Key elements for any school to build a winner: MOST EVERY SUCCESSFUL PROGRAM IN TEXAS HAS THIS SET UP.(4 BLOCK SCHEDULE):

Head Coach: Athletic Director or Cordnator all day and in all athletic classes when needed.

OC/DC= 1st block AM Teaches offseason class at feeder (OC at one middle school, DC at the other middle school)
2nd Block AM Teaches freshmen football class (at high school)
3rd Block confrence (with all coaching staff at HS)
4th Block versity football (with all coaching staff at HS).

All other assistant coaches: Teach 1st block and 2nd Block every day (subject they are certified in). 3rd block prep and 4th block varsity football.

Budget at least: 25K (some schools in EL Paso have this. Some are not even close).

All programs have STANDARD: DSV or any digital editing system with lap top cowboy remotes, server, digital cameras, endzone cameras, 2- 5 coach head set systems.

Indoor practice facility (can be at Aux gym at school with turf on the flooring-NOT ONE SCHOOL IN EL PASO HAS AN INDOOR FACILITY, NOT EVEN UTEP!!!!).

****Athletic Cordnator/Head Football coach is in control of all athletic budgeting. Assistant football coaches all coach multiple sports at high school. Athletic Cordnator has full control of all feeder programs (middle school coaches are hired by head football coach/athletic cordnator). Cordnator is looked at as administrator.

1/4 of cordnators salaries are paid by middle schools.


I WOULD LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT SOME BAND PROGRAMS IN EL PASO HAVE SYSTEMS IN PLACE WHERE THEIR HIGH SCHOOL DIRECTORS DO TEACH MUSIC CLASSES AT MIDDLE SCHOOL FEEDERS!!!! I DO NOT KNOW OF ONE FOOTBALL PROGRAM HAVING ALL CORDNATORS TEACHING FOOTBALL OFF-SEASON AT ANY MIDDLE SCHOOLS


Just letting you know what you need.
Salaries in EP for assistant coaches are very competitive with the rest of Texas. Head Coaches need to be paid as Administrator scale with extended days. No stipend for head coach. IF HEAD COACH DOES NOT HAVE ADMINISTRATIVE CREDENTIALS THEN HE MUST BE ON TEACHER PAY SCALE WITH STIPEND!

felt like saying AMEN, PRAISE THE LORD! to Gotta Light statement....lol

I played four years at coronado and now I live in the panhandle, and from what I can see, the difference between panhandle kids, houston kids, dallas kids, and the el paso kids we know and love, is that the other regions of texas football train longer, harder, and smarter. It is a beautiful combination of a very large group highschool football players working hard when they are told to and when they are not to, and being taught how to work correctly that builds a state championship caliber football team. Until El Paso teams and not just hard working individual players figure that out, El Paso teams will continue to struggle in the playoffs.

Hey Gotta A Light you are right about El Dorado and what they are accomplishing at such an early class. In football there were many starting sophomores and juniors on the team and they made it to the playoffs. In basketball there were many starting sophomores and juniors on the team and they made it to the sweet 16. Here is a video that I got from EPGridirons stuff over at Youtube. The guy that slam dunks is that Mcfarland kid who is only a sophomore. Gotta A Light that Mcfarland kid is Military family and look at how he dominated on 3 of Hanks seniors. This is the future of El Paso and it looks very promising.

Nice Video

I also believe that high school sports in El Paso looks quite promising in the years to come. Look at the strides El Paso high school football has made in the past 5 to 6 years. Look at the strides El Paso high school basketball has made in the past 5 to 6 years. Look at the strides El Paso high school soccer has made in the past 5 to 6 years. Look at the strides El Paso high school baseball has made in he past 5 to 6 years.

It's only going to get better. El Paso high school sports was down but it is beginning to rise. It is obvious.

Lots of you have made some valid points though do keep in mind that the city of El Paso will continue to construct high schools. It's what El Paso does. The city of El Paso is still growing and will continue to grow for many years to come. Though it won't surprise me if an El Paso team gets past the 3rd round of the Texas state playoffs within the next 3 years and yes that is even if the UIL passes their made up Draft of their new realigment.

I agree with Buffguy. The expectations are different, it is almost like the whole community depends on the players to work hard and win.

I'm glad to see and to say that El Paso is headed in the right direction with all that I've seen on this website and all that I've read on this message board. Still much work has to be done, no question, but all looks promising and it makes me proud. Soon an El Paso team will make it to State and when it happens I will be there. Show your EP Pride. Great read fellas.

We our making some noise in the early rounds of the playoffs. Which means we are knocking on the door.

Like many have said on this message board, El Paso high school football has been making large strides this new millennium compared to last century.

El Paso is creeping up on them out of town teams. The Lubbock’s, Amarillo’s, San Angelo's, Midland's and other out of town teams are not taking El Paso high school football teams lightly in the Texas State Playoffs any longer like they did back in the day.

Times are a changing and the positive movement that El Paso high school football is currently experiencing is phenomenal.

The Texas State Playoffs are only going to get better for El Paso high school football teams in the coming seasons.

El Paso football teams keep the momentum going it's only getting bigger. Snowball effect started in 2003 and is increasing. Keep it rolling. Still much work to do before the snowball can roll on its own.

It's a great time for El Paso high school football.

100% ElPasoProud

i hate socorro baseball but i got to admit they did deserve that 2009 state title.... which brings me to a thought.... that 2009 team from socorro has played baseball together since they were like 8,9 yrs old... they pretty much grew up with each other.. they know how to play the game by heart they had a great coach in forbes... there whole focus was baseball 24/7 its the reason they wake up in the morning... now we cant we do this for football.. i always heard a saying "WE BEND AND BEND BUT WE DONT BREAK" -coach jimmy melendez- head baseball coach Riverside High School... well the bulldogs lived up to that saying... you look at football here in el paso and its nothing compared to the east tx teams over there... you make it to the state championship and your in the enemies territory... 2009 socorro was had no home field advantage austin westlake and lufkin pretty much had that advantage but it didn’t mean nothing to the bulldogs they still won.... last yr in the playoffs for football riverside hosted big springs at riverfront stadium.. home field advantage for the rangers ended up getting embarrassed by the steers.. we dont take nothing seriously everybody here talks the talk but they never walk the walk... the only team to do that was parkland making it to the 3 round... i respect the 5A and 4A they have the toughest teams in the state but that means nothing we can beat them.. permian shoulda lost to the rams 2 yrs ago.... we have no focus at all all we want to do is screw around we don’t take practice seriously correct me if im wrong plz i wanna know..... franklin is the only team in 1-5A to make it to the 3rd round... riverside,chapin,and now parkland are the only 4As to make it to the 3rd round in this melennium... we dont want that will to win in the state playoffs and make a state championship birth...ppl say now that socorro won state it puts el paso on the map... ya for baseball but what about football... are we finally going to start talking the talk and walk the walk at the same time and stop being these over confident players that cant back up anything??? listen to the words of head baseball coach at riverside high school jimmy melendez.... "WE BEND AND BEND BUT WE DONT BREAK" lately we bend then break at the last second... can you prove el paso your school the east texas teams and most importantly yourselves that we can actually achive greatness just like the bulldogs did this 2009 season... im looking forward to it cant wait for the football season to start........ LETS GO RANGERS(cuz i bleed orange for live)