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An outsiders prospective on EP Football

I'm not here to bash anyone I'm just here to give you my take on EP football. I'm from LC, NM and being close by I've always kept up with EP football. Year in year out EP produces about the same amount and quality of D1 players as the whole state of New Mexico. So the quality of player is in EP, the thing is that they are so spread out. It seems like almost every team has "1" D1 player instead of "1" team having 5 D1 players.

The other thing I notice is lack of quality coaches. A city that size should attract some good coaches. Now before you might get made about me saying there is no good coaches answer me this. What coach has established himself to constantly win the 6A title? Lack of good coaching brings inconsistency in winning and no tradition. For example I'll just name of few NM programs that have both good coaching and tradition: Cruces High, Mayfield, Artesia, Goddard, Rio Rancho. I guarantee one of these teams if not 2 will be state champions this year because tradition. A good coach will bring the tradition and with tradition comes respect. Look at Alabama, Michigan, Ohio State. At the high school level look at Mater Dei, Centennia in California. Look at IMG and St Thomas in Florida. Chandler in AZ, Bishop Gorman in Vegas. Those teams took over the nation spotlight and the top Texas teams fell behind.

For a school to be successful in EP at the state level they need to hire a great coach. Also that coach is going to have to recruit some of the other D1 talent that's spread throughout the city to come play ball for him. The top high schools nowadays recruit so it's either you keep up or fall far behind. Imagine 1 team where Montez is the QB, Hankins as the RB and the QB from ElDo as a WR and a few more players to add on to that? That team could make a decent run in the playoffs. It would be nice to see one school set themselves above the rest of EP and start a tradition like this. I'm sure that team would have the talent to be a consistent top 15 team in Texas and better in some years. Until that happens EP will always have an inconstant winner of the district 6A title and a second round loss in the playoffs.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Trod0
For example I'll just name of few NM programs that have both good coaching and tradition: Cruces High, Mayfield, Artesia, Goddard, Rio Rancho. I guarantee one of these teams if not 2 will be state champions this year because tradition.


This is Texas, you cant compare winning in the Texas Playoffs to winning in New Mexico playoffs. I can guarantee that these schools you mention would NOT be able to get passed the 2nd round in our Texas Region 1 playoffs with just TRADITION.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Trod0
For example I'll just name of few NM programs that have both good coaching and tradition: Cruces High, Mayfield, Artesia, Goddard, Rio Rancho. I guarantee one of these teams if not 2 will be state champions this year because tradition. A good coach will bring the tradition and with tradition comes respect.


I'll have to agree with KoolArrow, those top tier NM schools you listed would most likely not make it past the 3rd round. ABQ and RR programs are not on the same level as programs in the panhandle and east part of Texas. LC and RR have had success against EP schools but I can guarantee they would fall the same fate as Montwood, Del Valle, Franklin etc

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Usually teams from New Mexico that end up going on to win STATE either lost to a El Paso team or struggled against a El Paso team at the beginning of that specific season.

So that there speaks volumes saying that New Mexico teams would easily have a difficult time getting through the 1st round of the Texas state playoffs.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

I'm not saying they will make the final 4 in the Texas playoffs but I know RR would go at least round 3. RR would have made Americas look way worse than what they did this past Friday if they didn't let off and play everyone. The RR score was basically the same with minutes to go in the second quarter as what the final score was. Don't let the final score fool you because it was a big time mismatch. Cruces is a different story because this school is tiny compared to Texas 6A. Cruces has around 1,500 students. So put them in the lower students enrolled bracket of 5A and they will go at least 3 round. If canutillo did it Cruces could easily do it.

Now back to what I was trying to get to. El Paso needs a good coach who can recruit some of the cities top players to play for 1 school. I'm saying if that would happen that 1 El Paso school would be able to be competitive in the state playoff. Trust me these other schools recruit EP need to do the same and jump on board. El Paso has talent to do so.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Spitfire
Usually teams from New Mexico that end up going on to win STATE either lost to a El Paso team or struggled against a El Paso team at the beginning of that specific season.

So that there speaks volumes saying that New Mexico teams would easily have a difficult time getting through the 1st round of the Texas state playoffs.


You're right. What I'm saying is that these schools i.e. Cruces schools compete with the EP schools with way less. For instance Cruces has 1,500 students Mayfield has 1,400 students but yet I seen Mayfield beat ElDo with 3,300 students. Why is that??? It's from coaching and a winning tradition. Honestly that should never happen to a well coached team with more talent. In no way am I saying these New Mexico schools can compete in the Texas playoffs. I'm just saying they are completing and beating El Paso with way less.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

SISD needs to stop building so many high schools

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Per Max Preps Archives

2004 Franklin 42 Las Cruces 20
2004 Las Cruces 28 Americas 7
2004 Mayfield 42 Americas 0
2004 Mayfield 42 Socorro 0
2004 Onate 34 Hanks 7
2004 Del Valle 34 Onate 7
2004 Cathedral 34 Santa Teresa 3

2005 Franklin 55 Las Cruces 7
2005 Las Cruces 41 Americas 8
2005 Mayfield 35 Americas 0
2005 Onate 21 Del Valle 14
2005 Cathedral 21 Santa Teresa 7
2005 El Dorado 57 Santa Teresa 0

2006 Bel Air 24 Las Cruces 14
2006 Hanks 42 Las Cruces 35
2006 Mayfield 15 Montwood 14
2006 Onate 28 Eastwood 6
2006 Canutillo 39 Santa Teresa 12
2006 Santa Teresa 26 Cathedral 14

2007 Las Cruces 40 Bel Air 0
2007 Las Cruces 48 Hanks 20
2007 Montwood 28 Mayfield 19
2007 Eastwood 20 Onate 9
2007 Santa Teresa 32 Bowie 6
2007 Canutillo 33 Santa Teresa 3

2008 Las Cruces 48 El Dorado 13
2008 Las Cruces 49 Eastwood 8
2008 Mayfield 35 Montwood 13
2008 Onate 12 Bel Air 9
2008 Socorro 21 Onate 14
2008 Irvin 33 Santa Teresa 6
2008 Santa Teresa 27 Burges 14
2008 Ysleta 33 Santa Teresa 14
2008 Socorro 42 Santa Teresa 14
2008 Cathedral 10 Santa Teresa 7

2009 El Dorado 49 Las Cruces 3
2009 Las Cruces 55 Eastwood 6
2009 Mayfield 42 Montwood 10
2009 Bel Air 28 Onate 14
2009 Onate 20 Socorro 6
2009 Irvin 35 Santa Teresa 0
2009 Burges 16 Santa Teresa 0
2009 Ysleta 23 Santa Teresa 17
2009 Socorro 17 Santa Teresa 14
2009 Cathedral 28 Santa Teresa 21

2010 Mayfield 51 Chapin 8
2010 Montwood 34 Mayfield 31
2010 Las Cruces 23 El Dorado 20
2010 Franklin 49 Onate 2
2010 Americas 54 Onate 6
2010 El Paso 34 Santa Teresa 26
2010 Santa Teresa 36 Socorro 26
2010 Santa Teresa 45 Cathedral 31

2011 El Dorado 26 Las Cruces 23
2011 Mayfield 28 Chapin 27
2011 Montwood 49 Mayfield 43
2011 Franklin 54 Onate 14
2011 Americas 62 Onate 14
2011 El Paso 42 Santa Teresa 7
2011 Socorro 53 Santa Teresa 39
2011 Santa Teresa 24 Cathedral 12

2012 Las Cruces 38 Chapin 14
2012 El Dorado 28 Mayfield 23
2012 Franklin 38 Mayfield 9
2012 Bel Air 20 Onate 14
2012 Onate 20 Socorro 13
2012 Austin 54 Santa Teresa 33
2012 Santa Teresa 42 Irvin 25
2012 Cathedral 21 Santa Teresa 14

2013 Las Cruces 56 Chapin 14
2013 Mayfield 17 El Dorado 14
2013 Mayfield 44 Franklin 42
2013 Onate 34 Bel Air 0
2013 Socorro 26 Onate 20
2013 Santa Teresa 42 Austin 6
2013 Irvin 24 Santa Teresa 8
2013 Cathedral 39 Santa Teresa 23

2014 Las Cruces 44 Montwood 18
2014 Mayfield 62 Franklin 55
2014 Onate 21 Eastlake 14
2014 Rio Rancho 46 Americas 18
2014 Santa Teresa 48 San Elizario 12
2014 Santa Teresa 18 Burges 16
2014 Hanks 35 Santa Teresa 6
2014 Santa Teresa 20 Cathedral 19

2015 Montwood 20 Las Cruces 14
2015 Mayfield 69 Franklin 49
2015 Eastlake 34 Onate 18
2015 Americas 33 Rio Rancho 21
2015 San Elizario 33 Santa Teresa 6
2015 Burges 32 Santa Teresa 6
2015 Hanks 44 Santa Teresa 2
2015 Santa Teresa 37 Cathedral 13

2016 Mayfield 23 Del Valle 21
2016 Rio Rancho 31 Americas 7
2016 Santa Teresa 7 San Elizario 0
2016 Cathedral 29 Santa Teresa 14

2017 Rio Rancho 42 Americas 10
2017 Del Valle 7 Mayfield 0

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

VQ35HR
SISD needs to stop building so many high schools


I live in the SISD and they have a good enrollment throughout all schools. I've been in El Paso for 4 years now that's why I bring up this tread. When I registered my daughter at Eastlake this year. I asked a teacher what's the enrollment because I thought it was the size of Centennial but I was way off. She told me they are 34 students shy of being 6A. But yes it would be nice to stop building schools and let the enrollment overall go up

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Exactly way too many High Schools

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Danny
Per Max Preps Archives

2004 Franklin 42 Las Cruces 20
2004 Las Cruces 28 Americas 7
2004 Mayfield 42 Americas 0
2004 Mayfield 42 Socorro 0
2004 Onate 34 Hanks 7
2004 Del Valle 34 Onate 7
2004 Cathedral 34 Santa Teresa 3

2005 Franklin 55 Las Cruces 7
2005 Las Cruces 41 Americas 8
2005 Mayfield 35 Americas 0
2005 Onate 21 Del Valle 14
2005 Cathedral 21 Santa Teresa 7
2005 El Dorado 57 Santa Teresa 0

2006 Bel Air 24 Las Cruces 14
2006 Hanks 42 Las Cruces 35
2006 Mayfield 15 Montwood 14
2006 Onate 28 Eastwood 6
2006 Canutillo 39 Santa Teresa 12
2006 Santa Teresa 26 Cathedral 14

2007 Las Cruces 40 Bel Air 0
2007 Las Cruces 48 Hanks 20
2007 Montwood 28 Mayfield 19
2007 Eastwood 20 Onate 9
2007 Santa Teresa 32 Bowie 6
2007 Canutillo 33 Santa Teresa 3

2008 Las Cruces 48 El Dorado 13
2008 Las Cruces 49 Eastwood 8
2008 Mayfield 35 Montwood 13
2008 Onate 12 Bel Air 9
2008 Socorro 21 Onate 14
2008 Irvin 33 Santa Teresa 6
2008 Santa Teresa 27 Burges 14
2008 Ysleta 33 Santa Teresa 14
2008 Socorro 42 Santa Teresa 14
2008 Cathedral 10 Santa Teresa 7

2009 El Dorado 49 Las Cruces 3
2009 Las Cruces 55 Eastwood 6
2009 Mayfield 42 Montwood 10
2009 Bel Air 28 Onate 14
2009 Onate 20 Socorro 6
2009 Irvin 35 Santa Teresa 0
2009 Burges 16 Santa Teresa 0
2009 Ysleta 23 Santa Teresa 17
2009 Socorro 17 Santa Teresa 14
2009 Cathedral 28 Santa Teresa 21

2010 Mayfield 51 Chapin 8
2010 Montwood 34 Mayfield 31
2010 Las Cruces 23 El Dorado 20
2010 Franklin 49 Onate 2
2010 Americas 54 Onate 6
2010 El Paso 34 Santa Teresa 26
2010 Santa Teresa 36 Socorro 26
2010 Santa Teresa 45 Cathedral 31

2011 El Dorado 26 Las Cruces 23
2011 Mayfield 28 Chapin 27
2011 Montwood 49 Mayfield 43
2011 Franklin 54 Onate 14
2011 Americas 62 Onate 14
2011 El Paso 42 Santa Teresa 7
2011 Socorro 53 Santa Teresa 39
2011 Santa Teresa 24 Cathedral 12

2012 Las Cruces 38 Chapin 14
2012 El Dorado 28 Mayfield 23
2012 Franklin 38 Mayfield 9
2012 Bel Air 20 Onate 14
2012 Onate 20 Socorro 13
2012 Austin 54 Santa Teresa 33
2012 Santa Teresa 42 Irvin 25
2012 Cathedral 21 Santa Teresa 14

2013 Las Cruces 56 Chapin 14
2013 Mayfield 17 El Dorado 14
2013 Mayfield 44 Franklin 42
2013 Onate 34 Bel Air 0
2013 Socorro 26 Onate 20
2013 Santa Teresa 42 Austin 6
2013 Irvin 24 Santa Teresa 8
2013 Cathedral 39 Santa Teresa 23

2014 Las Cruces 44 Montwood 18
2014 Mayfield 62 Franklin 55
2014 Onate 21 Eastlake 14
2014 Rio Rancho 46 Americas 18
2014 Santa Teresa 48 San Elizario 12
2014 Santa Teresa 18 Burges 16
2014 Hanks 35 Santa Teresa 6
2014 Santa Teresa 20 Cathedral 19

2015 Montwood 20 Las Cruces 14
2015 Mayfield 69 Franklin 49
2015 Eastlake 34 Onate 18
2015 Americas 33 Rio Rancho 21
2015 San Elizario 33 Santa Teresa 6
2015 Burges 32 Santa Teresa 6
2015 Hanks 44 Santa Teresa 2
2015 Santa Teresa 37 Cathedral 13

2016 Mayfield 23 Del Valle 21
2016 Rio Rancho 31 Americas 7
2016 Santa Teresa 7 San Elizario 0
2016 Cathedral 29 Santa Teresa 14

2017 Rio Rancho 42 Americas 10
2017 Del Valle 7 Mayfield 0


Cruces schools go 24-13 vs EP schools. Every single EP school they played has more enrollment than the Cruces schools. Some even more than double. Let's put in prospective, that's like if Clint and Fabens would have a winning record against the Cruces schools. The lesser schools should not dominate.

So now I'm sure you can see my point is that coaching and tradition win games. I'm not bagging on EP football, there is talent here. They just need better coaching.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Danny
Per Max Preps Archives

2004 Franklin 42 Las Cruces 20
2004 Las Cruces 28 Americas 7
2004 Mayfield 42 Americas 0
2004 Mayfield 42 Socorro 0
2004 Onate 34 Hanks 7
2004 Del Valle 34 Onate 7
2004 Cathedral 34 Santa Teresa 3

2005 Franklin 55 Las Cruces 7
2005 Las Cruces 41 Americas 8
2005 Mayfield 35 Americas 0
2005 Onate 21 Del Valle 14
2005 Cathedral 21 Santa Teresa 7
2005 El Dorado 57 Santa Teresa 0

2006 Bel Air 24 Las Cruces 14
2006 Hanks 42 Las Cruces 35
2006 Mayfield 15 Montwood 14
2006 Onate 28 Eastwood 6
2006 Canutillo 39 Santa Teresa 12
2006 Santa Teresa 26 Cathedral 14

2007 Las Cruces 40 Bel Air 0
2007 Las Cruces 48 Hanks 20
2007 Montwood 28 Mayfield 19
2007 Eastwood 20 Onate 9
2007 Santa Teresa 32 Bowie 6
2007 Canutillo 33 Santa Teresa 3

2008 Las Cruces 48 El Dorado 13
2008 Las Cruces 49 Eastwood 8
2008 Mayfield 35 Montwood 13
2008 Onate 12 Bel Air 9
2008 Socorro 21 Onate 14
2008 Irvin 33 Santa Teresa 6
2008 Santa Teresa 27 Burges 14
2008 Ysleta 33 Santa Teresa 14
2008 Socorro 42 Santa Teresa 14
2008 Cathedral 10 Santa Teresa 7

2009 El Dorado 49 Las Cruces 3
2009 Las Cruces 55 Eastwood 6
2009 Mayfield 42 Montwood 10
2009 Bel Air 28 Onate 14
2009 Onate 20 Socorro 6
2009 Irvin 35 Santa Teresa 0
2009 Burges 16 Santa Teresa 0
2009 Ysleta 23 Santa Teresa 17
2009 Socorro 17 Santa Teresa 14
2009 Cathedral 28 Santa Teresa 21

2010 Mayfield 51 Chapin 8
2010 Montwood 34 Mayfield 31
2010 Las Cruces 23 El Dorado 20
2010 Franklin 49 Onate 2
2010 Americas 54 Onate 6
2010 El Paso 34 Santa Teresa 26
2010 Santa Teresa 36 Socorro 26
2010 Santa Teresa 45 Cathedral 31

2011 El Dorado 26 Las Cruces 23
2011 Mayfield 28 Chapin 27
2011 Montwood 49 Mayfield 43
2011 Franklin 54 Onate 14
2011 Americas 62 Onate 14
2011 El Paso 42 Santa Teresa 7
2011 Socorro 53 Santa Teresa 39
2011 Santa Teresa 24 Cathedral 12

2012 Las Cruces 38 Chapin 14
2012 El Dorado 28 Mayfield 23
2012 Franklin 38 Mayfield 9
2012 Bel Air 20 Onate 14
2012 Onate 20 Socorro 13
2012 Austin 54 Santa Teresa 33
2012 Santa Teresa 42 Irvin 25
2012 Cathedral 21 Santa Teresa 14

2013 Las Cruces 56 Chapin 14
2013 Mayfield 17 El Dorado 14
2013 Mayfield 44 Franklin 42
2013 Onate 34 Bel Air 0
2013 Socorro 26 Onate 20
2013 Santa Teresa 42 Austin 6
2013 Irvin 24 Santa Teresa 8
2013 Cathedral 39 Santa Teresa 23

2014 Las Cruces 44 Montwood 18
2014 Mayfield 62 Franklin 55
2014 Onate 21 Eastlake 14
2014 Rio Rancho 46 Americas 18
2014 Santa Teresa 48 San Elizario 12
2014 Santa Teresa 18 Burges 16
2014 Hanks 35 Santa Teresa 6
2014 Santa Teresa 20 Cathedral 19

2015 Montwood 20 Las Cruces 14
2015 Mayfield 69 Franklin 49
2015 Eastlake 34 Onate 18
2015 Americas 33 Rio Rancho 21
2015 San Elizario 33 Santa Teresa 6
2015 Burges 32 Santa Teresa 6
2015 Hanks 44 Santa Teresa 2
2015 Santa Teresa 37 Cathedral 13

2016 Mayfield 23 Del Valle 21
2016 Rio Rancho 31 Americas 7
2016 Santa Teresa 7 San Elizario 0
2016 Cathedral 29 Santa Teresa 14

2017 Rio Rancho 42 Americas 10
2017 Del Valle 7 Mayfield 0


Now that you edited after you read my reply to your unedited post you add more schools. You tried to make it look more even than the schools you originally posted which Was Cruces and Mayfield. You added Santa T and Onate which I never even mentioned about having good coaching and tradition. You also added RR which I mentioned them about having good coaching and tradition. They have a 3-1 record against Americas. I'm surprised you didn't mention Gadsden or Chapparal along with Santa T. All these schools border EP and share that EP tradition and poor coaching.

This is not a blast on NM vs EP. This is about what good coaching and tradition could do. I was applauding EP for their talent, they just need better coaching to bring it all together to be more competitive in Texas.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Back in the day, Alamogordo was ranked #1 in the state of New Mexico. They came to Ratliff to face Odessa Permian who was ranked #1 in the State of Texas at that time as well. It was billed as the battle of the #1 teams. Sadly it ended in a 68-0 thrashing at the hands of MOJO. New Mexico is by no means comparable to Texas high school football.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

MOJO
Back in the day, Alamogordo was ranked #1 in the state of New Mexico. They came to Ratliff to face Odessa Permian who was ranked #1 in the State of Texas at that time as well. It was billed as the battle of the #1 teams. Sadly it ended in a 68-0 thrashing at the hands of MOJO. New Mexico is by no means comparable to Texas high school football.


How long ago was that? I never recalled Alamo ranked #1 in NM. If they were they were probably 4A or 3A at the time.

You guys are totally getting what I'm saying twisted big time. I never once said the top NM team can compete with top level teams in Texas!!!! What I said EP has decent talent but poor coaching. They need a coach that could bring all that talent together. Good coaching makes a program and tradition. Another perfect example is Odessa having a tiny population and less total talent than El Paso continually beat the El Paso schools. Why? Because coaching and tradition that's why.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Everybody gets what you're saying. I don't think you understand what we are saying. Even at 1500 enrollment and if those schools were 5A, you all would be trampled in abt 3 rounds in Texas (I'm being generous). Winning state championship against lesser competition does not make NM coaches geniuses. The proof is that none of those coaches that have been successful in NM have wanted to take on the challenge of coaching in Texas and if they have, have not been successful. Now, we all would definitely agree that there are simply to many high schools and our talent is spread thin. But i dont think you understand the powerhouses in TX such as Aledo, Everman, Ennis, and many, many others.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

......
Everybody gets what you're saying. I don't think you understand what we are saying. Even at 1500 enrollment and if those schools were 5A, you all would be trampled in abt 3 rounds in Texas (I'm being generous). Winning state championship against lesser competition does not make NM coaches geniuses. The proof is that none of those coaches that have been successful in NM have wanted to take on the challenge of coaching in Texas and if they have, have not been successful. Now, we all would definitely agree that there are simply to many high schools and our talent is spread thin. But i dont think you understand the powerhouses in TX such as Aledo, Everman, Ennis, and many, many others.


I get what you're saying but I'm saying that the school with 1,500 students with virtually no D1 talent on the football squad should not beat a school with 3,000 enrollment with more talent. Yes the competition is way way way lower in NM but the coaches found a way to keep their teams at the top of the state year after year even when their squads have no talent either. Texas is the same way, DeSoto, Allen, the woodlands, Manvel, Steele and etc are always at the top of the state. Its the same teams over and over with no Cinderella teams. All the teams I named and that you named all recruit players to play for their schools. El Paso needs a coach to do the same. El Paso is Texas 6th largest city but yet doesn't make a peep of noise when it comes to football. El Paso should not be losing to smaller lesser schools, thats my point.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

I agree that we should be making more noise but don't necessarily agree that those NM successful coaches would fare better than those here now. It's the age old question that has been posted here in epgridiron... what does El Paso need to do to win a state championship. So far, no one has found that answer.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

......
I agree that we should be making more noise but don't necessarily agree that those NM successful coaches would fare better than those here now. It's the age old question that has been posted here in epgridiron... what does El Paso need to do to win a state championship. So far, no one has found that answer.


Get a better coach to come in, I'm not saying a NM coach. Have that coach recruit some of the top player in the city to come play for him. That's the way to do it, that's what all to top schools do is recruit. If they did that EP could have a consistent top 15 team in Texas. They would be beating the basin teams, Lubbock, Abilene, San Angelo.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

This thread is bogus. Take any top 4 6a teams and any top 4 5a teams from El Paso and they all could be state champs in NM on a yearly basis. They may not win it all every year but they would make semi finals and play for the championship every year. Just like Cruces high Mayfield and both Rio rancho schools. #Truth bring any of those school over here and they would not make it past the 2nd round.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Ep football
This thread is bogus. Take any top 4 6a teams and any top 4 5a teams from El Paso and they all could be state champs in NM on a yearly basis. They may not win it all every year but they would make semi finals and play for the championship every year. Just like Cruces high Mayfield and both Rio rancho schools. #Truth bring any of those school over here and they would not make it past the 2nd round.


I agree. El Paso would have multiple State Champs if they played in New Mexico, not even a question.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Del Valle just beat Mayfield and isn't even a top 5 team in the city. Mayfield is always a contender for state.. LMAO

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

One of these days somebody should commission a serious study comparing school population, feeder stats and demos, etc. Because it seems like the "EPISD builds too man schools" argument gets thrown around way too easily.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Re: thread title. Meant to say perspective?

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

blake
Del Valle just beat Mayfield and isn't even a top 5 team in the city. Mayfield is always a contender for state.. LMAO


Point exactly. They should beat Mayfield year after year. They have more talent and enrollment. DV has a legit D1 QB and who's dad was a pro. I use to catch some passes from his dad when he was in college. Mayfield has "ZERO" D1 even prospect on its team this year. They are not good this year at all. DV is a guarantee state playoff team in Texas while Mayfield will probably not even make the playoffs this year in NM.

You guys are bringing up the point perfectly. EP schools should not lose to smaller lesser schools in Cruces. But yet since 2004 the series between Cruces and Mayfield is 24-13. Every EP schools is bigger than them and have more talent. Now ask yourself why do EP schools consistently lose to smaller schools with less talent???? It has to be the coaching.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Jake
Ep football
This thread is bogus. Take any top 4 6a teams and any top 4 5a teams from El Paso and they all could be state champs in NM on a yearly basis. They may not win it all every year but they would make semi finals and play for the championship every year. Just like Cruces high Mayfield and both Rio rancho schools. #Truth bring any of those school over here and they would not make it past the 2nd round.


I agree. El Paso would have multiple State Champs if they played in New Mexico, not even a question.


Agree also EP SCHOOLS SHOULD WIN STATE EVERY YEAR IN NM or it's a BUST. They have schools over 3,000 enrollment in EP and would play schools in NM with only 1400-1500 enrollment. Like you guys said they wouldn't even take it every year to me that's a bust with that many students and talent. Mayfield beating ElDo is the equivalent to Fabens beating Mayfield. That WOULD NEVER HAPPEN.

I don't know what you guys don't get, it's not a comparison between states. I'm saying with the amount of students and talent in EP they should be WAY BETTER AT FOOTBALL, and they are not!

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

yea that "talent too spread" argument is bs. EP schools aren't significantly different in enrollment than the rest of the state and El Dorado was one of the biggest schools in the state before Pebble Hills was built.

I know everyone tries to discount it, but money matters. Coaches in the rest of Texas generally make alot more than EP coaches. Midland/Odessa coaches are some of the highest-paid in the state. EP coaches are in the bottom 15% in terms of head coach salaries in TX. They're not going to compete w/ a place offering 100-120k when they're offering 85k. And that goes for assistant coaches too. Even quantity-wise I often see teams in the rest of the state having larger coaching staffs than EP.

Money also provides better facilities for training and attracting athletes and coaches. It also means more capability to send players to football camps in the offseason.

I'd also add that 'tradition' is easier to establish in school districts and towns with fewer schools. There's something to be said for having a town unified around one school that all the feeder schools exclusively tie into. That way you can get the feeder schools running your system. And playing in a less competitive state makes it easier to advance further and win championships, which helps attract more athletes and coaches to your school.

Comparing NM & EP football is entirely apples & oranges.

also notice I say "attract" rather than "recruit". recruiting is not legal for public schools, even if some try to do it.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Finally someone who gets it. That was an awesome reply and I learned some things from it. Like I say Eldo was a huge school even for the whole state. I didn't know that coaches got paid so much in TX. That's a good living with just coaching. The coach from my high school is getting 10k a season.

One of these schools here needs to get a good booster together and attract a good coach with competitive salary like the rest of the state. Boosters can also better the facilities which would attract the better athletes to play for that school.

Thank you for that reply

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Trod0
Finally someone who gets it. That was an awesome reply and I learned some things from it. Like I say Eldo was a huge school even for the whole state. I didn't know that coaches got paid so much in TX. That's a good living with just coaching. The coach from my high school is getting 10k a season.

One of these schools here needs to get a good booster together and attract a good coach with competitive salary like the rest of the state. Boosters can also better the facilities which would attract the better athletes to play for that school.

Thank you for that reply


Here's my Two cent contribution regarding this conversation...


http://www.star-telegram.com/news/special-reports/databases/article168974117.html

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Kingsrealm
Trod0
Finally someone who gets it. That was an awesome reply and I learned some things from it. Like I say Eldo was a huge school even for the whole state. I didn't know that coaches got paid so much in TX. That's a good living with just coaching. The coach from my high school is getting 10k a season.

One of these schools here needs to get a good booster together and attract a good coach with competitive salary like the rest of the state. Boosters can also better the facilities which would attract the better athletes to play for that school.

Thank you for that reply


Here's my Two cent contribution regarding this conversation...


http://www.star-telegram.com/news/special-reports/databases/article168974117.html


Wow that's a lot of money. EP has a lower cost of living compared to some of the higher paying areas. But I see your point, coaches want that top dollar and EP is towards the bottom compared to the state. Highest in EP is the Coronado coach at 90k.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

I think that's your opinion. Mayfield enrollment is down because of centennial. They havent always been this low. RR schools have over 2500 students. Last year RR Cleveland had 3D1 players mayfield had 2 maybe more. RR rams have 3 this year. I get what your saying but I'm not buying NM has better coaching. Maybe the fact that they can coach year around in NM helps. Like everywhere else El Paso has some great coaches and some not so great. Just like the rest of Texas and NM. Like I said earlier your point is bogus.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Trod0
Finally someone who gets it. That was an awesome reply and I learned some things from it. Like I say Eldo was a huge school even for the whole state. I didn't know that coaches got paid so much in TX. That's a good living with just coaching. The coach from my high school is getting 10k a season.

One of these schools here needs to get a good booster together and attract a good coach with competitive salary like the rest of the state. Boosters can also better the facilities which would attract the better athletes to play for that school.

Thank you for that reply


I believe the salaries I listed for TX coaches include both their coaching stipend and teacher pay, so you'd have to add the teacher pay (~50k) to the NM coach stipend as well. Either way, both NM & EP are way behind the rest of TX in funding. part of that is maybe due to desire, but I think alot has to do with just the general population having less money. EP is at or near the tail end when compared with the other major cities in almost every income statistic. per capita income is 4-10k lower than most other places.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Ep football
I think that's your opinion. Mayfield enrollment is down because of centennial. They havent always been this low. RR schools have over 2500 students. Last year RR Cleveland had 3D1 players mayfield had 2 maybe more. RR rams have 3 this year. I get what your saying but I'm not buying NM has better coaching. Maybe the fact that they can coach year around in NM helps. Like everywhere else El Paso has some great coaches and some not so great. Just like the rest of Texas and NM. Like I said earlier your point is bogus.


I never said NM as a whole had better coaching than EP. The NM teams that I mentioned do have better coaching than the EP schools though.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Subjective opinion. We can bebate it all day but when those teams won state they had several college players on their team. Maybe not all D1 but DII. That doesn't make them better coaches

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

mausDE
Trod0
Finally someone who gets it. That was an awesome reply and I learned some things from it. Like I say Eldo was a huge school even for the whole state. I didn't know that coaches got paid so much in TX. That's a good living with just coaching. The coach from my high school is getting 10k a season.

One of these schools here needs to get a good booster together and attract a good coach with competitive salary like the rest of the state. Boosters can also better the facilities which would attract the better athletes to play for that school.

Thank you for that reply


I believe the salaries I listed for TX coaches include both their coaching stipend and teacher pay, so you'd have to add the teacher pay (~50k) to the NM coach stipend as well. Either way, both NM & EP are way behind the rest of TX in funding. part of that is maybe due to desire, but I think alot has to do with just the general population having less money. EP is at or near the tail end when compared with the other major cities in almost every income statistic. per capita income is 4-10k lower than most other places.


Very true, NM is one of the poorest states out there. I honestly think new teachers start out at 34k. Which is peanuts compared to other places. I really hope something would happen and EP turn the corner. I'm not from here but live here now and have always followed EP sports. It would be nice to see these kids make some noise on a consistent basis at state. These kids deserve it, the city deserves it.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Ep football
Subjective opinion. We can bebate it all day but when those teams won state they had several college players on their team. Maybe not all D1 but DII. That doesn't make them better coaches


That's true, I respect your view. But coaching has a lot to do with it, Onate had 3 D1 players on the team last year and they were a tad over .500. Onate has always had not so good coaching in football. It's rare to get any team in our regional (LC, EP) area with 3D1 players at the same time.

Like you said the debate could go on and on and I do respect your views. I'm just rooting for an EP team to make some noise this year

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Brooks at Canutillo is the best coach in El Paso and has the best staff... Head and shoulders above the rest. They just need to poach a few kids from Franklin/Coronado and they go deep in the playoffs every year.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Transplant
Brooks at Canutillo is the best coach in El Paso and has the best staff... Head and shoulders above the rest. They just need to poach a few kids from Franklin/Coronado and they go deep in the playoffs every year.


Calm down Trans you beat a UNranked top 10 team and you also beat a Coronado team who has not been to the playoff in like forever. Oh and when you beat our Cougars then you can talk.

Yes our boys lost to Permian but atleast our Cougars travel out of town to play out of town opponents in the beginning of the season unlike your Canutillo who plays cupcakes with lots and lots of frosting.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

I'm not from El Paso or affiliated with Canutillo. I am only making reference to the original posters claim of lack of coaching in El Paso. Based on what Brooks and his staff do with what they have, I believe if you put that staff with a school that has a deeper talent pool, they are state contenders every year. Not taking away from the hard work the kids are putting in there, it's just Brooks is high level coach that gets over looked here in El Paso.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

CougarNation
Transplant
Brooks at Canutillo is the best coach in El Paso and has the best staff... Head and shoulders above the rest. They just need to poach a few kids from Franklin/Coronado and they go deep in the playoffs every year.


Calm down Trans you beat a UNranked top 10 team and you also beat a Coronado team who has not been to the playoff in like forever. Oh and when you beat our Cougars then you can talk.

Yes our boys lost to Permian but atleast our Cougars travel out of town to play out of town opponents in the beginning of the season unlike your Canutillo who plays cupcakes with lots and lots of frosting.


Here goes this guy making excuses for his purple cougars. No one is talking about your loss were talking about coaching and yes Brooks is in my opinion probably one of the best in the city and or state. He's developed that program from nothing, I know this because I played for the guy when we were little canutillo and we were nothing compared to now. So take your whining loss, sob story about how great you aren't somewhere else.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

What I see is ELP teams getting better and better. Montwood just beat both Frenship and Midland, after losing to both teams last season. I call that improvement. Moreover, ELD beat Frenship last night in a shootout. which makes me wonder when was the last time a team from the Permian basin lost back-to-back games to ElP teams?

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

......
I agree that we should be making more noise but don't necessarily agree that those NM successful coaches would fare better than those here now. It's the age old question that has been posted here in epgridiron... what does El Paso need to do to win a state championship. So far, no one has found that answer.
I was reading during the 2016 season but silent on commenting. There was again the repeated similar subject of what EP needs to do. Matt Stepp from DCTF laid out an impressive outline. He knows at least twice as much about the game than me, and five times as much about the business of it outside the lines.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Trod0
I'm not saying they will make the final 4 in the Texas playoffs but I know RR would go at least round 3. RR would have made Americas look way worse than what they did this past Friday if they didn't let off and play everyone. The RR score was basically the same with minutes to go in the second quarter as what the final score was. Don't let the final score fool you because it was a big time mismatch. Cruces is a different story because this school is tiny compared to Texas 6A. Cruces has around 1,500 students. So put them in the lower students enrolled bracket of 5A and they will go at least 3 round. If canutillo did it Cruces could easily do it.

Now back to what I was trying to get to. El Paso needs a good coach who can recruit some of the cities top players to play for 1 school. I'm saying if that would happen that 1 El Paso school would be able to be competitive in the state playoff. Trust me these other schools recruit EP need to do the same and jump on board. El Paso has talent to do so.

Uh yeah, that's illegal. I recall Permian got in trouble for that quite some time ago. Coaches can't "recruit" players to play for one team.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

HanksParent19
Trod0
I'm not saying they will make the final 4 in the Texas playoffs but I know RR would go at least round 3. RR would have made Americas look way worse than what they did this past Friday if they didn't let off and play everyone. The RR score was basically the same with minutes to go in the second quarter as what the final score was. Don't let the final score fool you because it was a big time mismatch. Cruces is a different story because this school is tiny compared to Texas 6A. Cruces has around 1,500 students. So put them in the lower students enrolled bracket of 5A and they will go at least 3 round. If canutillo did it Cruces could easily do it.

Now back to what I was trying to get to. El Paso needs a good coach who can recruit some of the cities top players to play for 1 school. I'm saying if that would happen that 1 El Paso school would be able to be competitive in the state playoff. Trust me these other schools recruit EP need to do the same and jump on board. El Paso has talent to do so.

Uh yeah, that's illegal. I recall Permian got in trouble for that quite some time ago. Coaches can't "recruit" players to play for one team.


It's illegal but it happens throughout the country, state of Texas and in the city of El Paso.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

BLiever
HanksParent19
Trod0
I'm not saying they will make the final 4 in the Texas playoffs but I know RR would go at least round 3. RR would have made Americas look way worse than what they did this past Friday if they didn't let off and play everyone. The RR score was basically the same with minutes to go in the second quarter as what the final score was. Don't let the final score fool you because it was a big time mismatch. Cruces is a different story because this school is tiny compared to Texas 6A. Cruces has around 1,500 students. So put them in the lower students enrolled bracket of 5A and they will go at least 3 round. If canutillo did it Cruces could easily do it.

Now back to what I was trying to get to. El Paso needs a good coach who can recruit some of the cities top players to play for 1 school. I'm saying if that would happen that 1 El Paso school would be able to be competitive in the state playoff. Trust me these other schools recruit EP need to do the same and jump on board. El Paso has talent to do so.

Uh yeah, that's illegal. I recall Permian got in trouble for that quite some time ago. Coaches can't "recruit" players to play for one team.


It's illegal but it happens throughout the country, state of Texas and in the city of El Paso.



Permian never got into trouble for recruiting. They let a third string player suit up for a game in violation of the 365 day rule. This kid never saw the field. ever. The year was 1993. A critical Mistake most recently made by El Dorado.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

HanksParent19
Trod0
I'm not saying they will make the final 4 in the Texas playoffs but I know RR would go at least round 3. RR would have made Americas look way worse than what they did this past Friday if they didn't let off and play everyone. The RR score was basically the same with minutes to go in the second quarter as what the final score was. Don't let the final score fool you because it was a big time mismatch. Cruces is a different story because this school is tiny compared to Texas 6A. Cruces has around 1,500 students. So put them in the lower students enrolled bracket of 5A and they will go at least 3 round. If canutillo did it Cruces could easily do it.

Now back to what I was trying to get to. El Paso needs a good coach who can recruit some of the cities top players to play for 1 school. I'm saying if that would happen that 1 El Paso school would be able to be competitive in the state playoff. Trust me these other schools recruit EP need to do the same and jump on board. El Paso has talent to do so.

Uh yeah, that's illegal. I recall Permian got in trouble for that quite some time ago. Coaches can't "recruit" players to play for one team.


Yeah the whole recruit word is illegal for high school but it is happening everywhere. It is something that is hard to regulate as there are many ways of doing it. Just don't use the word recruit but you can attract players to come play for you

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

It's no secret. It's why you see a lot of high school varsity football coaches at youth football games and practices of ages 5 to 12. Then you have the youth football coaches whispering in their players ears and also in their momma's and poppa's ears to play for this coach or that coach at that school or this school.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Trod0
Kingsrealm
Trod0
Finally someone who gets it. That was an awesome reply and I learned some things from it. Like I say Eldo was a huge school even for the whole state. I didn't know that coaches got paid so much in TX. That's a good living with just coaching. The coach from my high school is getting 10k a season.

One of these schools here needs to get a good booster together and attract a good coach with competitive salary like the rest of the state. Boosters can also better the facilities which would attract the better athletes to play for that school.

Thank you for that reply


Here's my Two cent contribution regarding this conversation...


http://www.star-telegram.com/news/special-reports/databases/article168974117.html


Wow that's a lot of money. EP has a lower cost of living compared to some of the higher paying areas. But I see your point, coaches want that top dollar and EP is towards the bottom compared to the state. Highest in EP is the Coronado coach at 90k.


So how much you figure they gave Price to lure him away from his team to coach the Hanks program? I figure it had to be quite a bit.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Stats show the truth, a lot of New Mexico wins there. I'm from El Paso and agree with you on your points. Our fans are taking it personal instead of having an unopionated perspective. But it's the same with our sports reporters they try so hard to make specific kids the hero especially when they are home grown and recruiters come look at these kids and instantly walk away. They talk about the greatness of coaches but never point out flaws especially the EP times reporter this guy couldn't be more biased

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Tell the truth
Stats show the truth, a lot of New Mexico wins there. I'm from El Paso and agree with you on your points. Our fans are taking it personal instead of having an unopionated perspective. But it's the same with our sports reporters they try so hard to make specific kids the hero especially when they are home grown and recruiters come look at these kids and instantly walk away. They talk about the greatness of coaches but never point out flaws especially the EP times reporter this guy couldn't be more biased


Thanks TTT for being open minded. I live in EP now and I try to find a good match up for the week and go watch that game. There is something about Friday night lights, watching how kids are developing and see who can make the next level. I do see that there is some talent in the city but inconsistency in some programs/schools they play for. I'm rooting for some coach/school to break through and make a consistent program in EP. I would love to see EP have some consistent success in the playoffs.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Sure is plenty of "outsiders" who know a hell of alot about El Paso football! Wish some of these college recruiters knew as much about us. Shout out to EP grid doing a hell of a job!

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

Do head coaches also teach in El Paso? Moved away many moons ago and back in the day they taught classes. I live in San Angelo now and the local head coaches do not teach, they are the campus athletic coordinators. Pretty sure it is the same in Mid-Dessa and Abilene.

Also, back in the day we practiced in the afternoon. Athletics was last period (2:30 back then) and started practice then. Here they practice at 6:00 in the morning until about 8:00 then head to class. In the afternoon I believe they do weights, conditioning, film etc.

Re: An outsiders prospective on EP Football

OldEPGuy
Do head coaches also teach in El Paso? Moved away many moons ago and back in the day they taught classes. I live in San Angelo now and the local head coaches do not teach, they are the campus athletic coordinators. Pretty sure it is the same in Mid-Dessa and Abilene.

Also, back in the day we practiced in the afternoon. Athletics was last period (2:30 back then) and started practice then. Here they practice at 6:00 in the morning until about 8:00 then head to class. In the afternoon I believe they do weights, conditioning, film etc.


I could be wrong, but I think the same teaching situation applies to coaches in EP. If the head football coach is tasked w/ being the school athletic coordinator, they don't have to teach.

I believe UIL limits how many hrs a week teams can practice, so I wouldn't think there would be much difference there. When I played at Chapin in 07, we had an athletic period at the end of the day and did study-hall for a portion of it, then go do circuit-training, including weight room and plyometric-type exercises. Then practice for a couple hrs after school. Film study was generally during lunch and Saturday morning.

As freshmen, we practiced a couple hr before school, then weightlifting after school on our own. A yr or 2 after that, they moved the freshman practice to afterschool.

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